Carragher, Lampard and Gerrard all missed penalties against Portugal. Leaders supposedly
Does missing a penalty in a shoot out automatically mean youâre not a leader?
In a major tournament. I would say most definitely yes. Even in 90 minutes.
Iâd be very surprised if Kane was left with the captaincy
I wouldnât have classed any of those three as natural leaders in the first place
Iâve a feeling cheasty is going to hit you with a very illustrious list of leaders whoâve missed penalties
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I was banking on it
Iâll call bullshit on Baggio. He wasnât near a leader on that team.
Maradonna missed against Yugoslavia. He can have that.
The list of players who have missed crucial penalties in major tournaments or finals is a whoâs who of the game.
Maradona, Messi, C Ronaldo, Modric, van Basten, Platini, Zico, Socrates, Schweinsteiger, Robben, Pirlo, Baggio, Baresi, Albertini, Raul, van Dijk, Terry, Lineker.
Is Messiâs tournament suddenly rendered null and void because he missed a penalty against Poland?
No mate, he redeemed himself. All 3 of those chaps missed penalties and they went out, again. They never redeemed themselves subsequently either.
Kane wonât redeem himself.
The true greats on your list all redeemed themselves
Scored the equaliser against Nigeria after 89 minutes with a clutch finish?
Scored the winner in the same game?
Scored a brilliant winner after 87 minutes in the quarter-final against Spain?
Scored two brilliant goals in the semi-final?
Not a leader?
Podolski is still playing club ball in Poland for his home club Gornik Zabrze. For his grandmother.
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He blew it mate.
Iâd give you Baresi in '94.
Carragher was brought on specially to take one unusually enough. Had been brilliant on them in training apparently. I think he scored his initial attempt but had to retake it iirc.
Kilcoo won the Feile in Wicklow the same day with Conor Laverty as coach @peddlerscross. Or possibly the same weekend. I saw them dishing out a footballing lesson that afternoon and caught extra-time onwards in the England-Portugal match.
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When did Platini redeem himself? France lost the semi-final meekly and he retired the next year.
Van Basten was effectively forced into retirement five months after his missed penalty.
Henrik Larsson blasted a penalty over the bar in the 2006 World Cup which was his final international game.
Neither Zico nor Socrates got any chance to redeem themselves.
The '94 World Cup was Baggioâs peak and he was never as good again.
I think the criteria youâre applying is, if the person who misses is English, theyâre of automatically weak character but if a non-English player misses, this doesnât apply.
Pretty much yeah. I think its in them. Pearce, Southgate, waddle, ince, the 3 boys in 06. "18. Kane
It isnt a coincidence anyway.
Well then itâs in the Italians and the Dutch and in Messi and all the rest.
Pearce scored two pressure penalties in 1996, including one against the team heâd previously missed against. But that apparently doesnât count as redemption.
And poor auld Ian Harte for us in 2002.
None of those three were natural leaders that missed in 06
He wouldnât lead a horse to water
2006 will always have a special place in my heart. I loved that Italian team, their semi against Germany was insane, and the final had plenty drama too. And Argentina played an absolute humdinger with Mexico in the last 16. Maxi Rodriguez scored a delicious volley.
But itâs probably the last World Cup where I had fuck all responsibility and could just immerse myself in it, which probably tints the memory
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What are natural leaders? Big lads with big chests like me brother Sylvest? Matthijs De Ligt?
Lads like Rummenige, Matheus, Cannavarro, Paolo Maldini, Costacurta, Cafu, Messi in '22. Dunga, Deschamps. Lads like that.
Lads that are unflappable. Lads that will win balls that theyâve no right to win. Lads that put the team above themselves or if they donât, elevate the team. Lads that will sacrifice their body at a whim to win a match.
Iâll change it to great leaders.
Every team has leaders. There are some that just wonât be beat and theyâre great leaders
England have never had a truly great leader in my lifetime.
Bryan Robson was possibly the guy but he was a cripple