This thread discusses the Content article: [url=http://www.thefreekick.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&Itemid=67&id=84]Rugby World Cup - Pool D Preview
Finally got around to finishing off an article that I started last week sometime. It may ramble a bit but I’ll stand over it. I’ve weighed everything up and I’m convinced Ireland will win the group.
Good read that. I share your optimism and think we can win the group. I don’t think there is that much debate about hooker in Eddie’s mind and I think the Ulsterman will start. Having said that if Flannery is the equal to Rory Best in the scrums (Paul Wallace doesn’t believe so) I would start him. Didn’t know there was a 9 day gap between our matches against Argentina and France. Thats much bigger than I had imagined. What are the gaps like between that game and the quarters and for the rest of the world cup.
Yeah we play France on the Friday and then Argentina on the following Sunday evening. That’t not a bad recovery time.
If we come second in Pool D then the QF is the following Saturday (6 days) and if we top the group then the QF is on the following Sunday (I’ll let you work that one out). After that all the games are weekends apart from the 3rd/4th place play-off. Is that a new addition by the way? Don’t remember it previously.
Interesting team selection from Argentina. They’ve picked Hernandez at out half against all the odds and have the Contepomi brothers in the centre. Means Coleto starts at full back and Agulla (don’t know him) is on the wing.
More adventurous thatn anticipated. That’s quite a bit of flair now at 9, 10, 12.
Argentina select Hernandez at fly-half
Wednesday, 5 September 2007 12:46
Juan Martin Hernandez has been selected at fly-half for Argentina for their World Cup opener against hosts France in Paris on Friday.
The 25-year-old Stade Francais star is a full-back by trade but has expressed a desire to play at number 10.
Pumas coach Marcelo Loffreda has chosen Hernandez for the position ahead of Felipe Contepomi and Federico Todeschini.
Contepomi moves into the centre, where he will partner his twin brother Manuel, while Todeschini - an expert place-kicker - is on the bench.
Regular number eight Gonzalo Longo is sidelined with a leg injury so Lucas Ostiglia is named at the back of the scrum.
Juan Martin Scelzo, Ignacio Corleto and Juan Manuel Leguizamon have all shrugged off minor knocks and will start.
But lock Rimas Alvarez is named on the bench, with Loffreda sticking with the second-row combination of Ignacio Fernandez Lobbe and Patricio Albacete.
The team is captained by veteran scrum-half Agustin Pichot.
ARGENTINA (v France): I Corleto; L Borges, M Contepomi, F Contepomi, H Agulla; JM Hernandez, A Pichot (capt); R Roncero; M Ledesma, JM Scelzo, I Fernandez Lobbe, P Albacete, J Fernandez Lobbe, JM Leguizamon, L Ostiglia.
Replacements: AV Basualdo, S Gonzalez Bonorino, R Alvarez, M Durand, N Fernandez Miranda, F Todeschini, H Senillosa.
I’m not an expert on rugby but I do follow it
A good read that. Just to throw in a few more George Hook quotes:
‘Ireland will not win the World Cup’
‘Ireland will not beat France in Paris’
‘Ireland have the one of the best full backs in the world on the bench’ (presumably he means Geordan Murphy)
‘John Hayes is one of the worse scrummagers in the world’
‘Ireland have no openside. David Wallace is not a natural openside, nor is Steven Ferris and Neil Best rumbles around the pitch lookig for men to hit rather than looking for the ball’
He response to a quote by O’Sullivan was interesting and quite true:
‘O’Sullivan aligned the fact that Richie McCaw is such a good back row forward to his height advantage. That’s like saying Tiger Woods has won 12 majors because he has big muscles. And the worse thing is that no journalist will take him up on that. We had the despicable situation with David Kelly who dared to question O’Sullivan and was shot down by the players’
By the way al the above are paraphrased but I think I got the essential points…
Just another point on the Rugby World Cup:
Is it true that seeding in the World Cup depends on your performance in the last one whereby Argentina failed to get out of their group so are third seeds again…
Therefore either Ireland, France or Aregntina will be third seeds when the next one comes around?
Crazy system if true…
therock67 wrote:
Yeah we play France on the Friday and then Argentina on the following Sunday evening. That’t not a bad recovery time.
If we come second in Pool D then the QF is the following Saturday (6 days) and if we top the group then the QF is on the following Sunday (I’ll let you work that one out). After that all the games are weekends apart from the 3rd/4th place play-off. Is that a new addition by the way? Don’t remember it previously.
Those gaps between games are far bigger than I thought. I presumed because of tv the games would be far closer together. The gaps will benefit us most out of all the teams because our first fifteen are far superior to our replacements.
The 3rd/4th play off is a new thing by the way. Pointless game. Lets hope we don’t have to face the indignity of playing in it,
farmerinthecity wrote:
Just another point on the Rugby World Cup:
Is it true that seeding in the World Cup depends on your performance in the last one whereby Argentina failed to get out of their group so are third seeds again…
Therefore either Ireland, France or Aregntina will be third seeds when the next one comes around?
Crazy system if true…
That’s the case at the moment Farmer and to be fair how else could they decide seedings given everyone’s reluctance to play Argentina in proper internationals outside of World Cups anyway?
There’s a fairly big clamour for change at the moment to reduce the competition to 20 teams which would be far better. You could have purely as an example (not based on current rankings):
Pot 1
New Zealand
South Africa
Australia
France
Pot 2
England
Argentina
Wales
Ireland
Pot 3
Scotland
Italy
Samoa
Fiji
Pot 4
Namibia
USA
Canada
Tonga
That has way better match-ups from the very start.
Think you meant sixteen teams there Rock.
Agree it would make it a lot better and your seedings there look spot on. Only quibble would maybe be Japan for Namibia. More viable league and far greater televisual/money/etc market.
Would the bottom two seeded pools then qualify or maybe just the bottom one? Possibly through a secondary tournament played a season before RWC? Not too many of their players play professionally and would face conflicting club demands and it could always be done during Six Nations/autumn touring periods.
I suppose essentially it’s a form of relegation but gives lower teams something to play for and could quite possibly be integrated into the Pacific Rim tournament.
Re third place play-off, yeah they’ve had this before. Was watching Setanta’s reviews of previous World Cups and it showed Gavin Hastings’ bouncing NZ prop Richard Lowe in the 1991 match. Also read some reference to NZ vs France at last RWC.
Ah yeah that old counting thing. Never been my strong suit.
Completely forgot Japan. I fairly rushed it and forgot the USA and Canada first but remembered them just before I hit “post”.
I presume just the fourth seeds would qualify and the suggestion of a B World Cup would probably be the best way to do it. Just do it during available international windows as you suggest. It will never happen because the IRB will have no interest in making it happen - that’s the pity. The first world cup was 16 teams and there were some cracking groups - especially given the teams’ current form:
Australia
England
USA
Japan
Wales
Ireland
Canada
Tonga
New Zealand
Argentina
Italy
Fiji
France
Scotland
Romania
Zimbabwe
farmerinthecity wrote:
I’m not an expert on rugby but I do follow it.
Similar to football and GAA for you then farmer?
Fats wrote:
Think you meant sixteen teams there Rock.
Re third place play-off, yeah they’ve had this before. Was watching Setanta’s reviews of previous World Cups and it showed Gavin Hastings’ bouncing NZ prop Richard Lowe in the 1991 match. Also read some reference to NZ vs France at last RWC.
Don’t remember that. I presume they are pretty meaningless games or are they similar to a full blown test match?
Totally analogous to Soccer third place play-offs.
Half hearted affairs that nobody remembers.
Players look slightly embarrassed.
Irish team named for the opening game against Namibia. Horgan hasn’t made it back but it’s a first choice team outside that. I suppose the only reals decision were:
Best v Flannery for hooker and Best won that as expected.
Murphy v Trimble for winger in the absence of Horgan and Trimble won that - probably expected too.
O’Driscoll named in starting XV
06/09/2007 - 11:49:14
Brian O’Driscoll has been named to start in the centre by Ireland Coach Eddie O’Sullivan in the Ireland team to play Namibia in the opening Rugby World Cup Group D game this Sunday in Bordeaux.
O’Driscoll has recovered on schedule from his fractured sinus and has been given the all clear following a scan on the injury.
Commenting on his selection, the Ireland Captain, who will be leading Ireland for the 39th time in his career, said: “I am delighted to get myself back on the field, especially to lead the team out in the first game in the tournament. The injury has healed very well over the last number of weeks and right on schedule, so myself and the rest of the squad can concentrate on this weekends game.”
O’Driscoll will be leading a strong Ireland selection for the game that includes David Wallace, who returns to the team after recovering from a niggling ankle injury that has bothered him for the last number of weeks. He will be joined by Simon Easterby and Denis Leamy in the backrow. In the backs, Andrew Trimble moves from the centre, where he played against Italy, and is named on the right wing in a back three that includes Denis Hickie and Girvan Dempsey.
Ireland Coach Eddie O’Sullivan said: "Brian has recovered well after his injury and was keen to get as many games under his belt from the start of the tournament, so it is a great boost for us to have him back and in the team.
“After the great reception we received on our arrival at the airport last night, the whole squad realise that we are now finally here in the Rugby World Cup and we have to hit the ground running against Namibia”.
“We expect Namibia to throw everything at us and we are under no illusion that it will be a tough day at the office. It is also the first game for them and they will have targeted this for a big performance, so this will not be as easy as many people outside of the Ireland squad expect”.
The Ireland team to play Namibia on Sunday, September 11 2007 in the Stade Chaban Delmas Bordeaux at 7pm (Irish time) is as follows:
Player
15 - Girvan Dempsey - Terenure College/Leinster
14 - Andrew Trimble - Ballymena/Ulster
13 - Brian O’Driscoll Captain - UCD/Leinster
12 - Gordon D’Arcy - Lansdowne/Leinster
11 - Denis Hickie - St Mary’s College/Leinster
10 - Ronan O’Gara - Cork Constitution/Munster
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9 - Peter Stringer - Shannon/Munster
1 - Marcus Horan - Shannon/Munster
2 - Rory Best - Belfast Harlequins/Ulster
3 - John Hayes - Shannon/Munster
4 - Donncha O’Callaghan - Cork Constitution/Munster
5 - Paul O’Connell - Young Munster/Munster
6 - Simon Easterby - Llaneli
7 - David Wallace - Garryowen/Munster
8 - Denis Leamy - Cork Constitution/Munster
Replacements:
16 - Jerry Flannery - Shannon/Munster
17 - Simon Best - Belfast Harlequins/
18 - Malcolm O’Kelly - St Mary’s College/Leinster
19 - Neil Best - Belfast Harlequins/Ulster
20 - Isaac Boss - Ballymena/Ulster
21 - Paddy Wallace - Ballymena/Ulster
22 - Geordan Murphy - Leicester
No real surprises in that 22. Who will drop out of the 22 after Horgan gets back? Could mean Trimble I suppose as Murphy can cover centre, wing and full back. Has Trimble ever played full back?
Like the HMS Sheffield reference in the article rocko.
How do you know Leamy is a good footballer? Did he play a bit of minor with Tipp or something?
Played a season with Essendon I think.
Agree Trimble is likely to loose his place altogether when Horgan comes back. He covers more positions and just offers more off the bench. AFAIK Trimble’s never played fullback. With Murphy and Wallace you literally have every position covered, which actually isn’t bad compared to when you remember us having to bring Humphreys on at fullback or on the wing.
Think EOS will take off a few of the more important players when the game’s won: O’Gara, Hayes, O’Connell and Wallace and O’Driscoll unless they look like they need game time.
Watched the interview with Eddie on Setanta last night and he was making the point about needing to build up a big score.
He said that unlike other groups because there’s 3 teams competing here for 2 places that it could come down to points difference. It’s far from inconceivable when you think about it. It only takes 1 draw in the 3 games or Ireland to beat France and lose to Argentina or whatever to make it happen.
In that case the other teams have an advantage, particularly France, as they know what scores Ireland have racked up against the minnows. He said it’s important to put as big a score as possible on the board anyway because they don’t want to lose out on points difference again.
Still think that might be better achieved by emptying the bench at some stage but I don’t think he’s looking at resting too many guys if it’s not going brilliantly.
That was extremely poor. We looked flat, made an unbelievable amount of handling errors, were far too slow at the breakdown and our lineouts were very poor. Quiet discouraging. While our scrum improved it was noticeable how it disimproved when Flannery came on for Rory Best. This is a conundrum which we will have to weigh up as Flannery is the all round better player imo.
Shame on ye for not commenting on Ireland v Namibia.
Saw this match in Bilbao with 7 or 8 Munster “fans.” Utter gobshites the lot of them. They all had Ireland jerseys and they were all over for the Georgia game and some of them had headed up to Bordeaux for that Namibia match. It’s unfair to pick them out as being Munster fans really because they were just an embarrassing reminder of the type of people who go to Ireland games (in any sport) these days. They had no notion of how one-sided a contest it was supposed to be, they were genuinely thrilled with the result (other than one expert in the group who suspected we should have won by more) and they loved Stringer and his funny height.
When we scored the penalty try in the second half they couldn’t figure out what happened. I hadn’t bothered to speak to them until that point but seeing their struggles and confusion when the scoreboard moved I interrupted their speculation to let them know a penalty try had been scored. Well that set them off among themselves debating what a penalty try was. I had given this nugget of information to the “expert” guy in the hope he’d explain it to the rest of them and he told them proudly why we’d scored without scoring. “But we went up by 5 points” the others protested and the “expert” was stumped. He spoke really quietly then and I suspect he was letting them know that I was wrong but he didn’t want to point out my error out loud. And these gobshites are all off to the next game from what I could gather.
Anyway the match itself was utterly appalling. Nothing much to say about the bulk of it other than: