I canāt see how anybody would do much damage with an ordinary non-automatic handgun.
Yeah, perfectly safe.
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Ah yes, the tired old Sidney tactic of trolling through years of posts to try and conjure up some inconsistencies, the sure sign of a beaten docket.
There is no inconsistency in anything I have said on the subject of mass murder attacks and guns, you are simply too dimwitted to comprehend the points being made.
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Yes, this is all so complicated!
And itās absolutely nothing to do with the availability of guns!
Just like the US civil war was nothing to do with slavery, it was about anything but slavery.
It constantly amuses me how RWNJs will deliberately try and delude themselves from accepting the bleedinā obvious.
But he is dealing in stats, so i think @Julio_Geordio did a fine job.
Of course socio-demographic factors are critical. However more stringent laws mean more stringent laws for everyone. So it would certainly be a good starting point.
Then you have a 25 year plan on a socio-demographic basis to develop a different outlook for people who are kids now.
Short term, stronger laws.
Long term, education
He did in his hole do a fine job, which is why he hasnāt responded to my making shit of his argument in my second response. Stats can be very misleading, unless you can break them down and do critical analysis. Exclude suicides and the conclusion is actually the opposite of what he argued, states with the most lenient gun laws have actually the lowest murder rates. Suicides account for 2/3 of gun deaths and are twice the murder rate.
In fact, the National Review 2013 study (which all of these arguments are based on), broke the data down further into suicides and murders and had this to say about nine states that rated high in the total gun deaths*: āthese states had too few homicides to calculate a reliable rateā.
The solution to gun related murders is get violent criminals off the streets, much stronger laws and sentencing for illegal gun sales and much stricter background checks on legal gun purchases.
*Alaska, Idaho, Maine, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, New Hampshire, Vermont and Wyoming".
I was asleep as soon as "he did in his holeā¦
No surprise there, as you have no interest in an argument backed by evidence, but believe any old shit based on something a lad you met in the pub told you.
I have no interest in lads who completely ignore what is actually being said.
I know text lacks context, but julio was obvious there
I understand perfectly what Julio said and why it is wrong. Lenient gun laws do not lead to higher gun murder rates in the US, in fact itās the opposite. Washington DC has strict gun laws by US standards and the gun murder rates are the highest in the country by far. The states with the most lenient gun laws have the lowest rates of gun murders.
Julio was not aware that 80% of gun deaths involving white people are suicides. This makes shit of his argument, as we know gun laws have no effect on suicide rates. Australia has implemented strict gun laws and yet itās suicide rate is still the same, Ireland has essentially the same suicide rate as the US. Take guns away and people find other means to kill themselves.
Unless you think murder is morally or legally equivalent to suicide, which clearly it isnāt.
Maybe I missed something (genuinely), how do we know this?
Because suicide rates in the US, where gun ownership is high, is comparable with western European countries where gun ownership is considerably lower. Japan has one of the highest suicide rates in the world, and close to zero gun ownership.
Labane cleaning house. In fairness julio made what seemed to be a good argument but maybe didnāt realise the suicide factor.
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schoolboy error in fairness
Confirmation bias, we have to always be on the lookout for it.
Many more reasons for suicide.
Not to mention the underreporting of it in Irl & UK
But strangely enough of the top ten states with the strictest gun laws;
- California
- New Jersey
- Massachusetts
- New York
- Connecticut
- Hawaii
- Maryland
- Rhode Island
- Illinois
- Pennsylvania
only 2 of them, Pennsylvania (39th) & Hawaii (29th), lie outside the bottom 10 states in terms suicides per 100,000 population
Any stats that say less guns = less gun deaths are too simplistic and need to be discarded immediately, m8.
Ah Jaysus, Julio has given up, donāt you start. Suicide and murder are not to be conflated, one involves killing yourself, the other killing others. As far as Iām concerned people have the right to kill themselves, regardless of how tragic it is for those left behind. Nobody has the right to kill someone else, unless in self defense or a justifiable war.
As Kev has correctly pointed out, there are many reasons for suicide, but the rate isnāt that different between states in the US or countries in the west. Murder rates vary dramatically in the same geographies. Confusing suicide statistics and murder statistics is madness.
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