Totti, heās the world champion in spitting, right?
The decision to award Lionel Messi the Golden Ball moments after he had lost in a World Cup final was certainly a strange one, but any suggestion that he didnāt deserve to win it is, quite frankly, utterly mental.
Messi was superb, brilliant, incredibleā¦ all of the other words, in Brazil at once. Perhaps you hadnāt noticed? Let us show you the ways:
[SIZE=5]Teams set up their entire defence in order to stop him[/SIZE]
Itās easier to do great things when the team you are playing against hasnāt decided to man mark you with all of their players.
Iran did this brilliantly for 90 minutes but all it took was a yard of space against tired legs and this happened:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-space.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/leo-messi-space-2.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-nigeria-1.jpg
Yes, James Rodriguez was absolutely superb throughout the tournament but teams didnāt focus almost all of their attention on just him, all of the time. Messi hasnāt had the space that Rodriguez got for his brilliant volley for about eight years, in any competition. He probably gets man marked when he goes to Tesco.
A little known secret about Messi is that there is one way you are guaranteed to stop him, and that is to foul him repeatedly. Messi āsufferedā 26 tackles in the tournament, a number bettered only by Alexis Sanchez (34), Neymar (35) and Arjen Robben (31).
The major difference between some of these players (HINT: NEYMAR AND ROBBEN) and the Argentina captain is that he never dives. Not that they do of course. (HINT: THEY DO, A LOT)
[SIZE=5]Cold, hard, statistics[/SIZE]
Through a combination of complicated algorithms and data too complex for a human mind like yours, and coincidentally mine, to understand, Opta and WhoScored ranked Lionel Messi as the best player in the tournament.
Fifaās weird review panel may have Sepp Blatter questioning their selection methods, but according to the stats that matter, Messi outperformed everyone else. On average. That whole Adidas sponsoring the tournament thing is just a side issue.
[SIZE=3]He was two goals away from winning the Golden Boot[/SIZE]
Only James Rodriguez (6) and Thomas Muller (5) scored more, with Muller playing in a team that scored seven in one game. Argentina only scored eight in the entire tournament.
[SIZE=3]He completed more dribbles per game than any other player[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-run.jpg
Messi has an averaged 6.6 successful dribbles per game, beating closest rival Alexis Sanchez who finished on 5.5. But that doesnāt mean he doesnāt pass:
[SIZE=3]Non-selfishness[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-dribble.jpg
Despite having dribbled with the ball the most, Messi also put the most amount of balls into the box, with his FIFA ādeliveries into penalty areaā (which is a fancier way of saying chances created) statistic showing that he did that 26 times during the World Cup ā more than any other player. His closest rival is Arjen Robben, who did that 19 times.
This is fewer times.
[SIZE=5]He is better than we think, because we have become accustomed to his brilliance[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-happy.jpg
If at any point in any Lionel Messi game he hasnāt scored a hat-trick or dribbled around the entire team, some people are disappointed. It is an inevitability, given his towering reputation. Youād also be disappointed if the Loch Ness Monster was just a crocodile and not this incredible dinosaur that shoots cake out of its eyes with lazers, as is my understanding of it.
Since 2004, Lionel Messi has scored 243 goals in 277 La Liga games for Barcelona. In 2012 he scored 91 goals in all competitions in one calendar year. IN ONE YEAR. If this was Football Manager youād think the game was broken.
La Liga doesnāt really offer the same high standard of crunching defensive challenges that a top league like the Scottish Premiership might, but for balance, he has scored 67 goals in 86 Champions League appearances.
But thatās totally normal because itās Lionel Messi. Itās just what he does.
[SIZE=5]He carried Argentina to the final[/SIZE]
Messi scored four out of Argentinaās eight goals, and assisted another - without him they wouldnāt have been anywhere near that final.
The assertion that Messi is only so great at Barcelona because heās surrounded by incredible players like Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets is often made, but is wrong. Barcelona, too, completely depend upon Messi. Take a look:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2011.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2012.jpg
In the 2013/14 season Messi scored less than 38% of all of Barcelonaās goals. It was the first time in seven seasons that Barcelona failed to win a trophy, other than that Supercopa, which is basically the Charity Shield.
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2013.jpg
Another of the great players in the tournament, Ronaldo, has similar statistics when playing for Real Madrid. But Portugal flew home about seven hours after they arrived at the World Cup.
Messi held Argentinaās hand all the way through to the final:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-arg.jpg
[SIZE=5]He almost scored the World Cup winning goal[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-shot.jpg
If Messiās shot had dropped inside the far post, as has happened approximately 80 billion times for Barcelona, thereās a fair chance that Argentina would have gone on to win the game. Had that happened there is little doubt heād have been hailed as the all time greatest human.
[SIZE=5]He adapted to tactics that didnāt suit him[/SIZE]
The entire point of watching Argentina games is to see Messi with the ball. Without him the sense of futility in even having the game on is like sitting down to watch an episode of The Simpsons on Channel 4 and realising itās one of the new ones, which is why some of Sabellaās tactical decisions were rather frustrating.
The first half of Argentinaās first game against Bosnia was so boring it actually hurt. A tactical change in the first half to a 4-3-3 formation with Gonzalo Higuain sitting at the top of the attack, gifted space to Messi and Aguero, which was perfect for the circumstances and resulted in Messi actually getting the ball.
Politely, he scored and made the game watchable. With things nicely tied in the first half of the World Cup final, Sabella took off Lavezzi.
Jose Mourinho, master of tactics, had an opinion on it:
Argentina had been playing with two lines of four, with Enzo Perez closing Phillipp Lahm and Lavezzi doing the same on the other side. Because they were so compact Messi could walk while defending and then when he got the ball he had the energy to make the difference. When Sabella brought Aguero on for Lavezzi, Argentina changed from a 4-4-2 to a 4-3-3 and they lost a lot of balance. Messi had to run much more after Lavezzi went off. The team lost balance and especially energy ā energy that they needed in extra-time.
[SIZE=5]His free kick against Nigeria[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-freekick2.jpg
The only other freekicks of note in the entire tournament were Blerim Dzemaili, of Switzerland, and David Luiz, of outer space.
Nigeria keeper Vincent Enyeama was so frustrated at his inability to get anywhere near this shot that he (jokingly) complained to the referee about how unfair it was, like when you have to play against the bigger kids at school.
[SIZE=5]Running around a lot does not = greatness[/SIZE]
Thomas Muller and Dirk Kuyt are just two of the players in the World Cup celebrated for their exceptional work-rate, covering something close to the equivalent of 17 marathons per match.
Messi, on the other hand, appeared to spend large parts of his time walking around unable to have any effect on play. How disappointing. Or is it?!
Another player who often looks like heās doing absolutely nothing is Mesut Ozil. How did he get on in the World Cup?
Ozil, like Messi, has worked out how to achieve more by doing less. The German does cover more distance on average than Messi, but just like him, his presence in a game can completely change the outcome of it in a heartbeat. Messiās actual output compared to how much it looks like he is doing is disproportionate.
There may also be a scientific reason for Messiās walk, walk, sprint style of covering a football pitch, as Guilleme Balague explains in his book Messi:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/Messi-muscle.jpg
If you want to be appreciated by people on Twitter, run around all of the time. Even if thereās no reason for it, just keep running about because thatās what brilliance is.
If youāre very smart youāll know that this is actually completely wrong, and conserving your energy for when itās needed is most important.
[SIZE=5]His teammates are fairly useless[/SIZE]
Argentina have some big names in their team: Di Maria, Aguero, Mascherano and Higuain are all rather famous, but without Messi, it doesnāt seem to work.
It brings back memories of the Argentina team of the 1986 World Cup, or their outfit from the original International Superstar Soccer:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/maradona1.jpg
āA suparstar MF Redondaā. They sure do. As for the straight and fast bit, if you replace that with slow build up and constant Moyesian crossing of the ball to no-one, then this still holds up. Maradona won that ā86 tournament of course, which is one of the many reasons he is regarded as the greatest player ever.
Perhaps Messi will never compare to the great one ā just imagine how good he would actually have to be to carry a team of talented, but largely average footballers all the way to a World Cup final, only to lose to Germany.
Wait a minuteā¦
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/maradona-messi.jpg
[SIZE=5]He doesnāt know how good he really is[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-sad.jpg
Messi appeared to look embarrassed as important Fifa people handed him his Golden Ball trophy, almost as though he didnāt think he deserved it. Fortunately, weāve already established that he absolutely did deserve it and of course he was embarrassed: heād just lost the biggest football match he might ever play in, was completely miserable and then made to be paraded around in front of millions of people to get a trophy which will forever remind him of a pain and torment he may never recover from.
How else are you supposed to react? Youāve just been fired from your job but theyāve given you a leaving card. How happy are you about that? Are you delighted about that situation? How about if lots of tourists you donāt know are taking photographs of you as open it?
Luckily for the world and Lionel Messi, according to my current save game in Football Manager 14, which as we all know is more accurate than real life, heās still really good when heās 29, so presumably the same when 31.
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-fm14.jpg
There is still time, Lionel. Who knows? He might be even better in four years
Missy fanboys canāt justify his collapse. The bottom line is that when it came to the crunch knockout games Missy was nowhere to be seen and it was instead less heralded players like Mascherano, Garay and Di Maria who led the charge while Missy went for cover.
Di Maria was shit apart from a goal put on a plate for him by Messi
plus he was injured for the semi final and final.
Fuck off. Di Maria did more in the knockout games than Missy and he only managed to play in a game and a half of them.
He was outstanding in the quarter final. Mascherano was outstanding in the semi final. Bomber was merely pointing out the players who performed in the knock out stages, which is where and when the big boys come out to play.
He did in his hole. He was one of the worst on the pitch against Switzerland, he lost the ball about 60 times
That further reinforces my point. After Di Maria hobbled off against Belgium, Argentina failed to score in the tournament again.
[QUOTE=āMark Renton, post: 984476, member: 1796ā]The decision to award Lionel Messi the Golden Ball moments after he had lost in a World Cup final was certainly a strange one, but any suggestion that he didnāt deserve to win it is, quite frankly, utterly mental.
Messi was superb, brilliant, incredibleā¦ all of the other words, in Brazil at once. Perhaps you hadnāt noticed? Let us show you the ways:
[SIZE=5]Teams set up their entire defence in order to stop him[/SIZE]
Itās easier to do great things when the team you are playing against hasnāt decided to man mark you with all of their players.
Iran did this brilliantly for 90 minutes but all it took was a yard of space against tired legs and this happened:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-space.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/leo-messi-space-2.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-nigeria-1.jpg
Yes, James Rodriguez was absolutely superb throughout the tournament but teams didnāt focus almost all of their attention on just him, all of the time. Messi hasnāt had the space that Rodriguez got for his brilliant volley for about eight years, in any competition. He probably gets man marked when he goes to Tesco.
A little known secret about Messi is that there is one way you are guaranteed to stop him, and that is to foul him repeatedly. Messi āsufferedā 26 tackles in the tournament, a number bettered only by Alexis Sanchez (34), Neymar (35) and Arjen Robben (31).
The major difference between some of these players (HINT: NEYMAR AND ROBBEN) and the Argentina captain is that he never dives. Not that they do of course. (HINT: THEY DO, A LOT)
[SIZE=5]Cold, hard, statistics[/SIZE]
Through a combination of complicated algorithms and data too complex for a human mind like yours, and coincidentally mine, to understand, Opta and WhoScored ranked Lionel Messi as the best player in the tournament.
Fifaās weird review panel may have Sepp Blatter questioning their selection methods, but according to the stats that matter, Messi outperformed everyone else. On average. That whole Adidas sponsoring the tournament thing is just a side issue.
[SIZE=3]He was two goals away from winning the Golden Boot[/SIZE]
Only James Rodriguez (6) and Thomas Muller (5) scored more, with Muller playing in a team that scored seven in one game. Argentina only scored eight in the entire tournament.
[SIZE=3]He completed more dribbles per game than any other player[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-run.jpg
Messi has an averaged 6.6 successful dribbles per game, beating closest rival Alexis Sanchez who finished on 5.5. But that doesnāt mean he doesnāt pass:
[SIZE=3]Non-selfishness[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-dribble.jpg
Despite having dribbled with the ball the most, Messi also put the most amount of balls into the box, with his FIFA ādeliveries into penalty areaā (which is a fancier way of saying chances created) statistic showing that he did that 26 times during the World Cup ā more than any other player. His closest rival is Arjen Robben, who did that 19 times.
This is fewer times.
[SIZE=5]He is better than we think, because we have become accustomed to his brilliance[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-happy.jpg
If at any point in any Lionel Messi game he hasnāt scored a hat-trick or dribbled around the entire team, some people are disappointed. It is an inevitability, given his towering reputation. Youād also be disappointed if the Loch Ness Monster was just a crocodile and not this incredible dinosaur that shoots cake out of its eyes with lazers, as is my understanding of it.
Since 2004, Lionel Messi has scored 243 goals in 277 La Liga games for Barcelona. In 2012 he scored 91 goals in all competitions in one calendar year. IN ONE YEAR. If this was Football Manager youād think the game was broken.
La Liga doesnāt really offer the same high standard of crunching defensive challenges that a top league like the Scottish Premiership might, but for balance, he has scored 67 goals in 86 Champions League appearances.
But thatās totally normal because itās Lionel Messi. Itās just what he does.
[SIZE=5]He carried Argentina to the final[/SIZE]
Messi scored four out of Argentinaās eight goals, and assisted another - without him they wouldnāt have been anywhere near that final.
The assertion that Messi is only so great at Barcelona because heās surrounded by incredible players like Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets is often made, but is wrong. Barcelona, too, completely depend upon Messi. Take a look:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2011.jpg
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2012.jpg
In the 2013/14 season Messi scored less than 38% of all of Barcelonaās goals. It was the first time in seven seasons that Barcelona failed to win a trophy, other than that Supercopa, which is basically the Charity Shield.
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-2013.jpg
Another of the great players in the tournament, Ronaldo, has similar statistics when playing for Real Madrid. But Portugal flew home about seven hours after they arrived at the World Cup.
Messi held Argentinaās hand all the way through to the final:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-arg.jpg
[SIZE=5]He almost scored the World Cup winning goal[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-shot.jpg
If Messiās shot had dropped inside the far post, as has happened approximately 80 billion times for Barcelona, thereās a fair chance that Argentina would have gone on to win the game. Had that happened there is little doubt heād have been hailed as the all time greatest human.
[SIZE=5]He adapted to tactics that didnāt suit him[/SIZE]
The entire point of watching Argentina games is to see Messi with the ball. Without him the sense of futility in even having the game on is like sitting down to watch an episode of The Simpsons on Channel 4 and realising itās one of the new ones, which is why some of Sabellaās tactical decisions were rather frustrating.
The first half of Argentinaās first game against Bosnia was so boring it actually hurt. A tactical change in the first half to a 4-3-3 formation with Gonzalo Higuain sitting at the top of the attack, gifted space to Messi and Aguero, which was perfect for the circumstances and resulted in Messi actually getting the ball.
Politely, he scored and made the game watchable. With things nicely tied in the first half of the World Cup final, Sabella took off Lavezzi.
Jose Mourinho, master of tactics, had an opinion on it:
Argentina had been playing with two lines of four, with Enzo Perez closing Phillipp Lahm and Lavezzi doing the same on the other side. Because they were so compact Messi could walk while defending and then when he got the ball he had the energy to make the difference. When Sabella brought Aguero on for Lavezzi, Argentina changed from a 4-4-2 to a 4-3-3 and they lost a lot of balance. Messi had to run much more after Lavezzi went off. The team lost balance and especially energy ā energy that they needed in extra-time.
[SIZE=5]His free kick against Nigeria[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-freekick2.jpg
The only other freekicks of note in the entire tournament were Blerim Dzemaili, of Switzerland, and David Luiz, of outer space.
Nigeria keeper Vincent Enyeama was so frustrated at his inability to get anywhere near this shot that he (jokingly) complained to the referee about how unfair it was, like when you have to play against the bigger kids at school.
[SIZE=5]Running around a lot does not = greatness[/SIZE]
Thomas Muller and Dirk Kuyt are just two of the players in the World Cup celebrated for their exceptional work-rate, covering something close to the equivalent of 17 marathons per match.
Messi, on the other hand, appeared to spend large parts of his time walking around unable to have any effect on play. How disappointing. Or is it?!
Another player who often looks like heās doing absolutely nothing is Mesut Ozil. How did he get on in the World Cup?
Ozil, like Messi, has worked out how to achieve more by doing less. The German does cover more distance on average than Messi, but just like him, his presence in a game can completely change the outcome of it in a heartbeat. Messiās actual output compared to how much it looks like he is doing is disproportionate.
There may also be a scientific reason for Messiās walk, walk, sprint style of covering a football pitch, as Guilleme Balague explains in his book Messi:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/Messi-muscle.jpg
If you want to be appreciated by people on Twitter, run around all of the time. Even if thereās no reason for it, just keep running about because thatās what brilliance is.
If youāre very smart youāll know that this is actually completely wrong, and conserving your energy for when itās needed is most important.
[SIZE=5]His teammates are fairly useless[/SIZE]
Argentina have some big names in their team: Di Maria, Aguero, Mascherano and Higuain are all rather famous, but without Messi, it doesnāt seem to work.
It brings back memories of the Argentina team of the 1986 World Cup, or their outfit from the original International Superstar Soccer:
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/maradona1.jpg
āA suparstar MF Redondaā. They sure do. As for the straight and fast bit, if you replace that with slow build up and constant Moyesian crossing of the ball to no-one, then this still holds up. Maradona won that ā86 tournament of course, which is one of the many reasons he is regarded as the greatest player ever.
Perhaps Messi will never compare to the great one ā just imagine how good he would actually have to be to carry a team of talented, but largely average footballers all the way to a World Cup final, only to lose to Germany.
Wait a minuteā¦
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/maradona-messi.jpg
[SIZE=5]He doesnāt know how good he really is[/SIZE]
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-sad.jpg
Messi appeared to look embarrassed as important Fifa people handed him his Golden Ball trophy, almost as though he didnāt think he deserved it. Fortunately, weāve already established that he absolutely did deserve it and of course he was embarrassed: heād just lost the biggest football match he might ever play in, was completely miserable and then made to be paraded around in front of millions of people to get a trophy which will forever remind him of a pain and torment he may never recover from.
How else are you supposed to react? Youāve just been fired from your job but theyāve given you a leaving card. How happy are you about that? Are you delighted about that situation? How about if lots of tourists you donāt know are taking photographs of you as open it?
Luckily for the world and Lionel Messi, according to my current save game in Football Manager 14, which as we all know is more accurate than real life, heās still really good when heās 29, so presumably the same when 31.
http://d1p3t35jiqtse7.cloudfront.net/content/uploads/2014/07/messi-fm14.jpg
There is still time, Lionel. Who knows? He might be even better in four years[/QUOTE]
Where did you find this article Mark?
Clearly you didnāt see the game. Di Maria was the best Argentina player on the pitch against Switzerland.
some of the best drilled national sides in the World set up to stop Lionel Messi from getting space - he occupied 2 or 3 defenders in every single game simply by being on the pitch
This argument is fucking ridiculous.
[QUOTE=āEsteban de la Sexface, post: 984574, member: 2695ā]some of the best drilled national sides in the World set up to stop Lionel Messi from getting space - he occupied 2 or 3 defenders in every single game simply by being on the pitch
This argument is fucking ridiculous.[/QUOTE]
Messi didnāt occupy players. He didnāt even want to know about taking the reigns for his team. He didnāt want the ball, he didnāt have the heart for it.
Iām struggling to believe you saw the game if thatās your opinion. He kept giving the ball away and getting crosses blocked and then got a goal laid on a plate for him by Messi. You are just a hipster who has to have a different opinion to everybody else
Di Maria was the driving force for Argentina throughout the competition. He was the guy who consistently showed for the ball and brought the game to the opposition. Di Maria may not be as talented a player as Missy but he has guts and character.
Surely the most successful wind up thread on TFK ever??? 11 pages of of @Il Bomber Destro talking shite and people actually engaging with him as if thereās a debate to be had? FFS the only agrees heās getting are Young Ned and the Village idiot! Dungeon!!!
If you cannot see his brilliance then I feel sorry for you. He is a player who plays the game the way it should be played. heart on the sleeve stuff, gets on with the game, scores goals, takes players on constantly, gets kicked and gets on with it. An ability to make the impossible look mundane.
Some of the best national sides in the World set up to deny him space and he still managed to get goals, even having a good chance against Germany which he flashed wide.
Keep looking for faults where there arenāt any, Iāll enjoy the 50/60/70 goals heāll score for Barcelona next season.
This thread was started nearly two years ago and Missyās collapse in the knockout stage has validated my argument and shown me to be ahead of the curve.
what this thread is, is you using a barely relevant excuse to vindicate a fucking stupid two year old thread and making an absolute fucking show of yourself again. In my opinion.
[QUOTE=āEsteban de la Sexface, post: 984587, member: 2695ā]If you cannot see his brilliance then I feel sorry for you. He is a player who plays the game the way it should be played. heart on the sleeve stuff, gets on with the game, scores goals, takes players on constantly, gets kicked and gets on with it. An ability to make the impossible look mundane.
Some of the best national sides in the World set up to deny him space and he still managed to get goals, even having a good chance against Germany which he flashed wide.
Keep looking for faults where there arenāt any, Iāll enjoy the 50/60/70 goals heāll score for Barcelona next season.[/QUOTE]
He didnāt show any brilliance in the knockout stages. He didnāt even want to know about it.