Euthanasia

Did anyone see the guy on sky news the other night?

Craig Ewert was an American man suffering from the effects of motor neuron disease who opted to undergo assisted suicide in Switzerland. His assisted suicide, which occurred at a rented Zurich apartment while his wife watched nearby. An employee of the Swiss clinic, Dignitas, can be seen preparing a lethal dose of barbiturates on camera and Ewert drinks it and dies.

Its sparked off debates about whether or not it should be legalised. I know if I was like him, Id want to go out with some dignity and not have to live and endure pain if I was goin to die anyway. I remember a terminally ill woman a few years ago took a case to the courts in England for the right to die which they turned down, I think it was a few weeks later she choked on her own saliva cos she could no longer swallow, terrible stuff.

My Grandfather had a fairly serious stroke over two years ago and has been hospitalised since and has no hope of ever coming out of it to be honest…His memory is all but gone and can be belligerent at the best of times…He has little or no real quality of life and it is tough to watch a very proud gentleman all but waiting to die…

He is completely institutionalised and has little or no comprehension of the world outside anymore…

It is a grey area to be honest are there are arguements both for and against it…All I know if the same thing happens to me I would like to go quick and not be all but stuck in a bed for 2/3 years dragging out the inevitable when I am in my late 70’s/early 80’s…

I voted for, but i`m gonna say only voluntary euthanasia because if you include involuntary euthanasia you open up a totally different can of worms.

For it all the way.

for voluntary alright its awful to see people who are in severve pain and would rather die than having to stay alive because its illegal

Boston Legal dealt with this issue very well.

Very sad case here about a rugby player who was paralysed and wanted to die, his parents helped him. Terrific article by that cunt Brian Moore.

[COMMENT][/COMMENT]It took courage for the parents of Daniel James to say goodbye

The best consequence of success in sport is the opportunity to enrich the life of someone else.

By Brian Moore
Last Updated: 10:08PM BST 24 Oct 2008
This is a feeling nobody, however rich, can buy. As a former international hooker, I know that it also brings other things equally moving, of greater import and sometimes inspirational, but never a pleasure.

I vividly recall my first visit to a rugby player who was in one of the countrys acute centres having suffered serious spinal injury. As I write I can feel the tears welling and as then, I cannot stop them.

I was not prepared for the experience, not understanding what might be my reaction. More importantly, what it needed to be to help the unfortunate boy who, either side of a collapsed scrum, had looked forward to his degree course at university, but now contemplated a lifetime of manual evacuation of his bowels, assisted feeding and knowing he would never be independent.

Though rugby is not the most dangerous of sports, there are serious injuries, and those pertaining to the front row, particularly to hookers, resonate keenly. The uniquely vulnerable world of the hooker within the scrum is one in which I dwelt for years without serious injury.

However, I also remember the times I got the engagement, the 'hit, wrong, suffering a 'stinger, a neurological shock like a lightning bolt down my spine: when I was driven upwards, my neck being slowly bent, close to hyperextension, before I managed to pop my head out of the scrum: when the front rows collapsed and all I could do was turn my head a little to minimise the chance of my neck taking all the weight of the collapse and fracturing.

Daniel James, son of Julie and Mark, represented England at under-16, university and student level at hooker. In playing for the last two teams he was following the same path which years earlier had led me to that which also cannot be bought; the honour of representing my country at full international level.

I know how Daniel felt pulling on the No 2 jersey; the mixture of fierce determination and pride, edged with fear and the pressure of carrying not only his dreams, but those of his friends and especially his parents. I know Julie and Mark were so very proud.

I am sure that in a quiet moment before he played, he thought of his mother and father. How much he owed them for driving him to training, coping with his mood swings according to how he had played and just how much he loved them. I hope he told them at the time, because too few of us do.

Unfortunately, I know exactly how, in March last year, Daniel dislocated his spine when a scrum collapsed during a training session at Nuneaton RFC.

Colleague Mick Cleary, in his earlier column, chose precisely the phrase which is more apposite to me than most, given the similarities with Daniel.

There but for…

I cannot dwell on that collapse as it reminds me too much of my mortality and that someone else was chosen by fate to suffer. I cannot know the workings of Daniels mind as he struggled with his catastrophic injury and, if I am honest, I do not want to because in those thoughts lies madness.

I can make an educated guess at how his mum and dad felt when they were told of his accident and with what they battled thereafter. If the following sounds patronising, so be it; only a parent can come remotely near understanding what it must have been like for Julie and Mark.

If you have not had a child, your perception of this is intellectual. That is what makes parenthood special, it is emotional. You may hypothesise that Julie and Mark would gladly have swapped places with their son; but you cannot feel that or the guilt they probably feel for encouraging him to play the game that, at times, they will feel killed their son.

All this is secondary to the astonishing courage they showed in accompanying Daniel to the Dignitas clinic in Berne, where Daniel was assisted to take a life which to him had become unbearable, particularly given the contradiction of rude health and near total incapacity.

I do not know how they faced the conflicting emotions of saying goodbye to the little boy they saw score his first try and the desperate wish to keep him with them. If they get counselling, which they must, they may have to face admitting something I felt while watching my father struggle through the last hours of his life, gasping for breath that when I cried please dont struggle anymore, part of this was because I selfishly wanted him to spare me any more pain.

My father was elderly, but still the walk from his deathbed was a searing experience. No parent should have to bury a child and I do not have the ability to suppose what that walk felt like for Julie and Mark.

It is still an offence under the Suicide Act 1961 to aid, counsel or procure the suicide of another; the penalty is up to 14 years imprisonment. Julie and Mark now face the ordeal of investigation by the West Mercia police following notification of their act of love by a 'concerned individual.

Of that person I say concerned is the last thing you were, other than in an intellectual exercise of morality, a concept incapable of standard definition by two people, never mind entire organised groups however concerned they, in their delusion, may be.

Among the many letters Julie and Mark will get, there will be a handful which will say they will be punished on the final day. Yes, some people are that pitiful. To such authors I put this if you reserve judgment for God, why usurp this by presupposing the conclusion?

If there is a God I believe He will understand what was done and why.

Headlines have stated that Julie and Mark have defended their actions. Mr and Mrs James, you have to do no such thing. If there is a final reckoning, it is between you and your God no one else.[COMMENT][/COMMENT]

Good article carter - I was aware of the case and was going to mention it. There was another case of a mother assisting in the suicide of her daughter in England last week too.

I’m in the middle on this, and flip flop on it from time to time. The humanity and compassion in me says that we should leave it up to the individual to decide their own fate especially when it comes to minimising pain and suffering. However I’m deeply concerned at the thought particularly of those suffering from deep depression being allowed access euthanasia for fear that those who can be saved end up taking their own lives.
I hope to God none of us is ever faced with this decision.

WBY

Could this be linked to the suicide thread at all? Would allowing this reduce the “other” type of suicide rates? I’d be for it but only if it was voluntary or for terminally ill people or something like that.

[quote=“dancarter”]Very sad case here about a rugby player who was paralysed and wanted to die, his parents helped him. Terrific article by that cunt Brian Moore.

It took courage for the parents of Daniel James to say goodbye

The best consequence of success in sport is the opportunity to enrich the life of someone else.

By Brian Moore
Last Updated: 10:08PM BST 24 Oct 2008
This is a feeling nobody, however rich, can buy. As a former international hooker, I know that it also brings other things equally moving, of greater import and sometimes inspirational, but never a pleasure.

[/quote]

Shocking.

im not sure what i would want in this situation but what pisses me off is that people who have never have had to make that call lecturing people who are in the middle of that situation about what to do

  • its easy to be high & mighty when an issue doesnt directly affect you

[quote=“north county corncrake”]im not sure what i would want in this situation but what pisses me off is that people who have never have had to make that call lecturing people who are in the middle of that situation about what to do

  • its easy to be high & mighty when an issue doesnt directly affect you[/quote]

I don’t know if thats always the case. Who knows more about sex than the catholic church?

puke

Is that bestiality you’re talking about NCC :rolleyes:

A “no” from me.

How does a no response actually answer the question posed?

Oh right then, whatever. “Against”, guvnor.

good to see your keepiong the lowest common denominator low anyway hannel

As Bachman-Turner Overdrive said You Ain’t Seen Nothing Yet