Ah Larry, so what if he was sold for 10M, thats means nothing these days. But he is improving, and i am impressed by his improvement in conditioning, its starting to pay dividends. Still think he does some headless things, and his crossing is erratic. I’m fairly certain, without watching the actual league, that Russia has more good teams than Scotland for him to play against, so he should continue to improve.
No way in hell is Doyle better than Quinn, ever. Quinn may not have been as mobile, but bloody hell he had a better head.
Hope Stokes can push on alright, he seems to have matured.
theres a kid in chelseas squad who is meant to be very good. (unfortunately i cant think of his name). duffy from everton also looks a very good prospect.he is only 18 and has already played for evertons first team.unfortunately he got badly hurt recently playing for ireland.hopefully by the next wc mccarthy, coleman, duffy, kid from chelsea, cunningham and stokes will on be all playing regulary in the premiership.
Gola specifically asked if anyone would be worth 10 million so it’s particularly relevant. McGeady’s conditioning improved immeasurably in recent seasons at Celtic. That people didn’t see it or chose not to is irrelevant really. He isn’t any stronger or faster now than he was six months ago.
[quote=“caoimhaoin, post: 527208”]
Ah Larry, so what if he was sold for 10M, thats means nothing these days.[/quote]
I don’t think larry made any claim about what it meant - he was answering gola’s specific question about whether any of our players were worth 10 million. gola didn’t specify the currency he was referring to but I can confirm that McGeady went for EUR€12m, which when converted at the rate of exchange on the date of purchase translated to GBP£9.8m. The Russian league is much stronger than the SPL; the latter is ranked 16th in Europe this season, while the Russian league has risen to 6th on the back of recent UEFA Cup Final victories for Zenit and CSKA Moscow. CSKA progressed to the Champions League quarter finals last season too.
I’d obviously really like to see our young players start to make waves, and the sooner the better. I think there’s a tendency in Ireland to be in thrall to the English Premier League and you’ll see posters on other forums and certain journalists wetting themselves over some prospects the minute they get a sniff of making an EPL squad. There was a bit of this with Gibson when he scored a few goals for the Manchester United League Cup team but he needs to back it up with regular impressive performances. The likes of Coleman also needs to get a good run at Everton now and dislodge yer journeyman Hibbert from the team. McCarthy deserves to be looked at in this next friendly given his own form and the fact his position is an area where there’s a place up for grabs.
As regards the question about the generation overall; I always thought Owen Garvan had excellent natural ability and I’m disappointed that he seemingly hasn’t pushed on.
Great post, bandage…Garvan is an interesting one, he certainly looked a decent midfielder in the making alright, although The Irish Van Bommel’s treatment of him didn’t help his development…Think he went to Crystal Palace in the summer, haven’t heard any about his form there and is very much under the radar…he certainly has a bit about him and is a decent passer of the ball from my limited viewings of him…Chris McCann of Burnley is another option but think he has been struggling with injuries for the past 18 months
I liked Garvan too. He’s played most games for Palace but not all and he’s been in and out of the team a bit. Not where you want your great hope playing.
I think there’s too much made of the likes of Coleman and even young Clifford at Chelsea. They’re miles off being first team regulars at the moment and as KIB Man sometimes says - it’s ridiculous to consider them an option at this stage.
The youth team isn’t as successful as in previous generations but it’s a bit dismissive also to say we didn’t produce McGeady or McCarthy. Both played a significant amount of underage football for Ireland (McGeady joined the Irish setup at Under 15 level). There’s plenty of work to be done there but the Keane and Duff team was a bit of a rarity alright.
Garvan missed almost a year at Ipswich with a mystery virus after first bursting onto the scene, so that may have slowed his development to some degree.
He clearly is. He put on a nice bit of muscle in the off season.
Why are ye so insecure and sensitive about everything Celtic, it really is a common trait amongst their fans. I was only pointing out a positive i had noticed, that seems to be helping him with Ireland and his general game. The added strength will add to his power and pace.
I know what Gola was asking lads, but the value system is all over the shop now, circumstances and a selling club’s finances have as much to do with the value of a player as his actual ability. My point really is i wouldn’t be judging him, good or bad, on a transfer value.
Lads Coleman has proved himself at Championship level and has looked very good when played for Everton, i wouldn’t be classing him in the same category as Clifford and the likes. He is the real deal IMO.
He clearly is. He put on a nice bit of muscle in the off season.
Why are ye so insecure and sensitive about everything Celtic, it really is a common trait amongst their fans. I was only pointing out a positive i had noticed, that seems to be helping him with Ireland and his general game. The added strength will add to his power and pace.
I know what Gola was asking lads, but the value system is all over the shop now, circumstances and a selling club’s finances have as much to do with the value of a player as his actual ability. My point really is i wouldn’t be judging him, good or bad, on a transfer value.[/quote]
No that’s not true.
Those who have seen McGeady regularly will know that he added pace and bulk after Strachan signed and hired a French conditioning coach in his second season who’se (for Bandage) name escapes me. He has been noticeably very quick since then. KIB Man disagreed on here many times citing a solitary misguided example that he misinterpreted but he’s no faster now than he was then. And that’s when he added the muscle too. He’s done nothing much to add to that over the summer - in fact he was injured for most of it and did fuck all exercise at all. You may believe you know better but you’re spectacularly wrong.
[quote=“caoimhaoin, post: 527217”]
Lads Coleman has proved himself at Championship level and has looked very good when played for Everton, i wouldn’t be classing him in the same category as Clifford and the likes. He is the real deal IMO.
[/quote]I hope Coleman makes it. He played 10-12 games for Blackpool. I doubt you saw too many of those. He’s looked reasonable playing for Everton but prone to really bad defensive errors. Plenty of learning yet for him. I think he’s a prospect but he’s a million miles away from being the real deal.
Gregory Dupont was the former Celtic sport scientist that did a lot of one-to-one work with McGeady that resulted in him bulking up and gaining speed in 2007/08 when he won POTY and YPOTY.
When did Shaun Maloney win those awards? Halycon days for the Celts though.
The example That the rock 69 is on about is away to Cyprus when on the counter attack McG was dispossessed by a defender after having a 10 yard start on him. I still dont believe he is a flyer either. Would say Duff is still quicker though he can’t get away from players like he once used to. Long is probably the quickest in a squad alarmingly short on pace.
It is true, because i saw him last season, and have seen a change. It was noticeable to me. Now i’m not saying he hasn’t been gradually improving over a season or two, but i noticed a fair difference from this season to last. Someone else actually pointed out on here sometime as well. Players can train when they are injured by the way, depending on the injury.
I hope Coleman makes it. He played 10-12 games for Blackpool. I doubt you saw too many of those. He’s looked reasonable playing for Everton but prone to really bad defensive errors. Plenty of learning yet for him. I think he’s a prospect but he’s a million miles away from being the real deal.
Saw the play offs, but thats not really the point, i don’t need to have seen him to read every glowing report of him, he helped in a big way get a team from nowhere up to the EPL, thats proving himself IMO, especially at such a young age. I have seen him 3 times play EPL, and he never made a massive defensive error that i can think of. Maybe saying the real deal is jumping the gun, but he is a excellent prospect. I’m sure he’ll be delighted to hear you think he is though.
The only thing spectacular here is the arrogance on your soccer opinion and the spectacular insecurity Celtic fans (here especially) seem to have. Its like you feel if MacGeedy does well now, Celtic need to get the praise for it. :lol:
I already made the point that you formed an opinion based on your own myopic view of a single incident where you failed to take into account reasonably important factors such as a standing start, waiting for the ball etc into consideration. Thanks for rehashing the same argument but there really was no need.
If you do actually think Duff is quicker than McGeady then I’m afraid you are once again greatly mistaken. McGeady’s been doing 8.8m/s with the ball this season. Care to provide similar stats for Duff?
yeah the defender had to turn around and chase him. McG looked like he had concrete boots.
Lies, damned lies and stats, would still have far more confidence in Duff beating a full back and getting behind him regardless of what m/s you care to quote.
[quote=“caoimhaoin, post: 527223”]
It is true, because i saw him last season, and have seen a change. It was noticeable to me. Now i’m not saying he hasn’t been gradually improving over a season or two, but i noticed a fair difference from this season to last. Someone else actually pointed out on here sometime as well. Players can train when they are injured by the way, depending on the injury.[/quote]
That may be what you think you’ve seen but as someone who has watched far more of McGeady than you I can categorically state his speed improvements occurred about 3 seasons ago and he hasn’t really gotten any quicker since. Watch his performance for Celtic against Benfica in the Champions League to see him flying past the full back every time maybe.
Of course some players can train with some injuries but McGeady missed about 3 months with a calf injury this summer. It’s a touch unlikely that he improved his pace over that same period.
Look, I’m not arguing that you’ve noticed his speed increase in the last couple of months. That may well be the case. I’m simply pointing out that it actually happened a couple of years ago and he’s no quicker now than he was a year ago.
[quote=“caoimhaoin, post: 527223”]
Saw the play offs, but thats not really the point, i don’t need to have seen him to read every glowing report of him, he helped in a big way get a team from nowhere up to the EPL, thats proving himself IMO, especially at such a young age. I have seen him 3 times play EPL, and he never made a massive defensive error that i can think of. Maybe saying the real deal is jumping the gun, but he is a excellent prospect. I’m sure he’ll be delighted to hear you think he is though.[/quote]
He played 10 games or so. He did well but playing 10 games in England’s second tier is not proving yourself in an international context. How many games have the likes of Hoolahan and Garvan and Morrisson and others played at that level? It’s promising but it’s far from “proving yourself.” There’s no need to stick to your guns on an argument when you’re blatantly wrong.
I don’t think anyone is disputing the fact that he’s a very good prospect. But that’s all he is at the moment. He can’t get into a struggling Everton team in his natural position. He’s played a bit on the wing which is not where Ireland need/want him with Duff, McGeady, Lawrence, Fahey, Hunt all very capable there.
He’s been lucky with two penalty decisions in his appearances so far. He was also badly exposed defensively in the Europa League last season. I wouldn’t write him off on the back of those errors obviously and there’s every chance that he will continue to improve but the main point is that he needs to improve. He will but it’s a question of how much. On current performances he’s a prospect but he’s drawing attention to himself because of his performances for his age not because of the performances themselves.
Banal point really.
Often people who are unsure of their facts and throw out unsupported opinions that they can’t justify believe that those who actually have informed opinions to the contrary are arrogant. That’s just one of the ways of the world. Much like the unpopular nerd thinks everyone else in his class is a bully, so the buffoon on a forum thinks everyone else is arrogant.
I couldn’t care less whether McGeady’s speed improved at Celtic or Spartak, I just thought I’d point out the work done by Gregory Dupont (google him) in his development. As someone who waffles on about conditioning every day I thought you might have a small bit of interest in the facts and the science behind his improvements. It turns out you’d rather copy your clone KIB Man and just decide to stick to your original opinion despite known evidence to the contrary.
Here’s a short article for you on Dupont if you do change your mind: