Munster, celtic league, heineken cup, general and tag rugby thread 🐐

Sport
7181

No idea Rocko. Was surprised to see him go off against Connacht when he was going well and thought there might have been an injury. Given his track record its not hard to believe that he’s injured again.

7182

Ya, i’m surprised as well. Tom Gleeson on the wing is a strange one. He’s not out and out pacey, but i suppose thats nothing new for Munster wingers. :smiley:

7183

Munster out-munstered last night and O’Gara had a nightmare with the boot. A bit worrying ahead of next weeks game.

7184

not at all. a good kick in the hole was needed.

7185

Leinster were well bullied by Glasgow the other night. A clutch of silly yellow cards didn’t help but Leinster were blown away in contact and at the breakdown. Glasgow do have an excellent back row but it was still a bit disappointing. The youngsters were largely overpowered and missed some basic tackles too.

7186

Connacht 31-3 down to the scarlets at half time!

7187

58-10 at the finish. That’s farily embarrassing.

7188

Great link between Cave and Smith there for an Ulster try. Ulster have a shite record against Edinburgh but they’ll surely have all the motivation required to get something from this game.

7189

3 games in a week with Connachts scarce resources, this was inevitable, hence why they targeted the two home games I suppose.

7190

Sublime from Humphreys there.

7191

Bonus point try for Ulster now. That’s a huge win assuming they hang on.

7192

Fucking hell, Ferris over for a try now. Ulster a man down and have just strolled in 2 tries to kill the game off.

7193

There is no doubt Ulster are a better team than Connacht and would have a way better chance of doing well in HEC. I would have liked the novelty of Connacht in it though.

7194

Connacht arent out of it yet. As I said earlier, they targetted Munster and Leinster last week and like Leinster, tossed their game at the weekend. The Amlin offers them their best chance though. It depends what side Toulon send over.

Watched the Munster match last night. Had O Gara hit his kicks they would have won easily, and should have. They were as good as Ospreys and suffered a little at the breakdown as they have for a bit now since the new rule interpretations. The one stand out for me is how much Varley has developed this year, he put in another stand out shift when he came on and was unlucky not to cross the line.

Damien Traille is out for BO on Saturday, huge boost for Munster. I don’t see them losing this game.

7195

Yeah they obviously rested lads for it but they won’t have expected Ulster to pick up 5 points at Edinburgh and they will have secretly hoped they might grab a losing bonus themselves. They clearly don’t have any strength in depth so can write off the result but it’s not that easy to go from a hammering to grinding out wins.

I’m finding it hard to see either province win to be honest. Haven’t given it much thought but I think both Toulouse and Biarritz are superior teams. They have home advantage too and the form of either Irish province is nothing to write home about.

I reserve the right to change my mind before the weekend though obviously.

7196

Munster were poor the weekend, but gererally are the weekend before a big game.

BO are a fair bit below the level they have been in recent years, and expect Munster to beat them. Toulouse are an enigma, they were muck for 40 minutes of their q-final and then turned it on for 20 to seal the win. Leister defence is teh best in the competition, so they have a chance, albeit an outside one.

Muster -v- Toulouse in Paris I reckon


7197

I’d pretty much agree with that. PO’C definitely won’t play, Micko in. On form Micko has played better since the new year anyway.

7198

I would argue BO are above where they’ve been in recent years (ie last 3-4), esp in Europe, but still think Munster will have too much for them, even with home advantage. Any thoughts on Mafi being picked on the wing on Saturday in order for him to have a crack at Ngwenya?

Good win for Munster in the B&I Cup over Ulster on Saturday too I see, for what its worth. Good blooding for some players in essence, but when you see the likes of Mossie and Manning there you’d wonder a little.

7199

Mossie Lawlor was a shock inclusion alright. Has he been injured or what?

Is it a bit mad trying Mafi there now, but i’d like to see him ahead of Dowling for that reason, taking on that monster.

Your right mbb, Biarritz are well ahead of where they have been for past 2-3 seasons.

7200

Gerry T at his best.

Havent watched as much Top 14 as I’d have liked this season, but its looking like a dinger of a contest.

Seen a bit of Super 14 this season, have really been enjoying watching the Q Reds especially, McKensie has done a massive job there.

RUGBY/ FRENCH TOP 14: The fall-out from the end-of-season clashes will have significant implications for Irish teams, writes Gerry Thornley

FLUSH WITH cash from its television deal with Canal+ and from wealthy benefactors, the nouveaux riches have turned the old order on its head. Bigger soccer stadiums have hosted capacity crowds, and while the largesse and quality doesn’t extend from one to 14, the most fascinating Top 14 in years reaches a compelling final round of matches today with play-off, Heineken Cup qualification and relegation issues going down to the wire.

The fall-out will also have significant implications for the Irish teams who face Toulouse, Biarritz and Toulon in next weekend’s eagerly anticipated European semi-finals. There had always been some interest in the composition of the top six and qualification for the Heineken Cup, but this season that race has been given added intrigue.

Where previously the cherished and mystical Bouclier du Brennus was fought off between the top four, with straight semi-finals on neutral venues followed by the decider in the Stade de France, this season the Ligue Nationale de Rugby expanded the play-offs to include the top six.

The top two still qualify automatically for the semi-finals in three weeks, but now the third- and fourth-placed sides will play hosts to the sixth and fifth respectively in what amount to quarter-finals a week after next weekend’s European semi-finals.

Toulon, who face Connacht in the Amlin Challenge Cup semi-finals at the Sportsground next Friday, and Perpignan are best placed to progress to the semi-finals. Toulon face the tougher task today, as they are away to Brive, who can still secure seventh place and possible qualification for next season’s Heineken Cup, whereas reigning champions Perpignan should have little difficulty in seeing off already relegated Albi at home.

Third-placed Clermont are at Biarritz, who are in seventh and can also secure possible Heineken Cup qualification by winning that game should Toulouse or Toulon win either the Heineken Cup or the Challenge Cup. Toulouse welcome Castres in what amounts to a straight shoot-out for home advantage in what will be quarter-final re-match.

Elsewhere, Montauban are at home to Bayonne in a relegation shoot-out to accompany Albi into the ProD2, or as the twice-weekly rugby bible Midi Olympique rather dramatically labels it, “une finale de la mort”. Montauban could win and still be relegated, although at least their players have decided against boycotting this crucial game. This would have been in protest at the political infighting surrounding their desperate search for the funds needed to appeal the Ligue’s decision to relegate the club for their shaky financial situation.

Only two matches don’t matter. Montpellier welcome Bourgoin and, in a stark commentary on the changed fortunes in the capital, Stade Français play hosts to Racing Metro. Such has been the catastrophic nature of Stade’s season they are out of the play-off picture, whereas newly promoted Racing have reached the play-offs and next season’s Heineken Cup.

“Le Derby! Quel Derby?” sniffed l’Equipe.

As with Munster, it looked as if Toulouse’s old dogs for the hard road had rediscovered their mojo with the whiff of silverware in their experienced nostrils on the basis of their impressive Heineken Cup quarter-final dismantling of Stade. Whereupon they lost away to Bourgoin last week.

Now they must beat Castres today to secure a home quarter-final, with the Leinster game the first of a potential five knock-out matches in a row. In the opinion of Guy NovĂšs, their coach of the last 15 years, that is too much, and he has declared the rouge et noir are making the Heineken Cup the priority over the Top 14.

“Since the start of the season, I keep saying that the schedule doesn’t allow a club to play well in both championships. It’s impossible for a squad to play five high-level matches in a row. When you have the opportunity of receiving the opponent in the semi-finals of European Cup after such a difficult season, it’s normal that this fixture feels so important. And when you are 80 minutes away from the finals, it seems logical to want to take the last step.”

Ingenious scrumhalf cum outhalf Jean-Baptiste Elissalde, who returned against Bourgoin after a long absence through injury, supported his coach. “The main goal of the club is this semi-final fixture in the European Cup, and the defeat against Bourgoin doesn’t much change the rest of the (French) championship. The shortest way to Stade de France is to defeat Leinster and we are going to focus on that for the next 15 days.

“This weekend we’ll play against Castres, and of course there are stakes, but are they really our priority? Shouldn’t we concentrate all our energy on the European Cup? I don’t think that getting hurt this weekend just to receive our opponents in the (French) quarter-finals is really worth it.”

Toulouse’s inconsistent form can largely be put down to their unsettled half-back partnerships. Elissalde and Frederic Michalak (out for the last five months of the season) have been injured, while Byron Kelleher has not been the force of nature he was last season, and outhalf David Skrela is simply too slow, which allows defences to drift off him, and his kicking game is unreliable.

Big-tackling French captain Thierry Dusautoir pulled a thigh muscle in the defeat to Bourgoin but he trained this week, while Grégory Lamboley, Louis Picamoles and Shaun Sowerby all have ankle injuries.

But Elissalde is back, they have unrivalled backrow resources and three gamebreakers outside. And the classy, intelligent and immensely strong Yannick Jauzion is back at the top of his game. He turned the quarter-final around with a try on half-time, before creating the match-winner. They also have the master man-manager in Noves and a bench that usually turns games around.

For Biarritz, that the Heineken Cup is their “objectif prioritaire” is even more clear-cut, as they missed out on the top-six play-offs and automatic Heineken Cup qualification for next season.

Imanol Harinordoquy broke his nose against Racing Metro, when Biarritz led 14-3 at half-time before losing 29-22, and will not play against Clermont today. But the Biarritz assistant/backs coach Jack Isaac, their Australian former centre, said the injury was “not as bad as it first looked” and that the brilliant Basque number eight could be back training on Monday.

They remain heavily reliant on their core of experienced French internationals, and Fabien Barcella, Dimitri Yachvili and Damien Traille have missed a chunk of the season, but Isaac refused to use that as an excuse.

“We got hit hard by injuries, but we were abysmal against some of the lower placed teams this season and those games tend to come back to haunt you at the end of the season, which is exactly what happened. We’ve only got ourselves to blame for the position we’re in.”

There remains the possibility that seventh place in the Top 14 could earn qualification for the Heineken Cup. Hence, they have to play that card today too. Aside from not wanting to rely on Toulon beating Brive, and thereby securing seventh place regardless, Isaac says: “We thought that it’s probably a better idea to keep the intensity and momentum rather than rest too many players. We’re conscious of the risks, but it’s a risk worth taking.”

It will be a similar selection to last week and next week, while they welcome back the ex-Sale and English flanker Magnus Lund from injury.

Winning the Cup for the first time would also ensure qualification next season, aside from redeeming their season.

“When I played for Biarritz from 2000 to 2004 the Heineken Cup was always important to be involved in but not necessarily the major objective of the club.

“And little by little, especially in the last couple of years, it’s become a real objective to get on our hands on the trophy, and that’s probably been reflected in our preparation for the Heineken Cup this year as opposed to our domestic “comp”.”

But Biarritz remain a dangerous Cup team, primed for the big days, not unlike Munster, to whom they owe one for the last meeting, the 2006 final in Cardiff. Isaac chuckles when describing Munster as very good, adding: “They’ve got a very good backrow, their tight five are very active. A lot of people talked about the Ospreys backline, but Munster have a serious backline with O’Gara at 10, who can drive you mad with your kicking game, and de Villiers or Mafi or Earls in the centres – really class players.

“Then you’ve Dougie Howlett on the wing and Warwick at fullback, who’s got real genuine speed and is a seriously dangerous player. For me, there’s a lot of individual threat in the Ospreys, but the collective threat of the Munster backline is probably more dangerous.”

Toulon are the sensation of the French season and a 10-game winning run (eight in the Top 14) has taken them to the top of the table. Backed by comic book millionaire Mourad Boudjellal, Toulon returned to the top flight last season, but they appeared to be as much a home for overseas celebrities as a rugby club. A working-class town whose sense of identity is most vividly expressed through RC Toulon, the Stade FĂ©lix-Mayol is reckoned to be the most intimidating and passionate club rugby ground in France.

This also ensures its players are the kings of the town, and treated as such. Tana Umaga has had his first stint as head coach there, but it was widely believed a drinking culture pertained throughout the squad, whereupon former French winger and Sale coach Philippe Saint-André came in and cracked the whip. A smart and passionate rugby man, Saint-André introduced 7am training sessions as part of a more disciplined regime. He also brought in his fitness staff from Sale Sharks, Tom Whitford and Steve Walsh, and quickly began lining up players when he agreed to take over as head coach this season, fully eight months in advance.

Aside from the revered Jonny Wilkinson, second in the Top 14 scoring charts with 211 points, the Bourgoin-born Pierre Mignoni has been revitalised by his return from Clermont (the same is true with prop Laurent Emmanuelli). The Puma warrior Juan Martin Fernandez Lobbe, hooker SĂ©bastien Bruno and Felipe Contepomi have all been shrewd buys, while South African Johann van Niekerk and ex New Zealand rugby league star Sonny Bill Williams give them their X-factor.

“We mustn’t get carried away by the madness that reigns around the squad,” said Saint-AndrĂ© after the stunning 33-23 win over Perpignan last Saturday in front of 50,000 at the Stade Velodrome in Marseilles. “Now we have two options (the Top 14 and Challenge Cup). I’m proud of my players but, today, we haven’t won anything yet. It felt like a final, but it wasn’t.”

Of today’s game, Saint-AndrĂ© says: “Winning at Brive and directly qualifying for the semi-finals would spare us the play-off and therefore an additional match.”

Were they to lose and have to play a home quarter-final in two weeks, it’s more likely they would rest their front-liners, Wilkinson et al, from the Connacht game.

And as much as the Connacht supporters might like to see Wilkinson and the rest of the Toulon heavy-hitters, that might not be a bad thing.

THE IRISH ANGLE: WHO THE PROVINCES FACE

STADE TOULOUSAIN

Heineken Cup opponents : Leinster.

Formed : 1907.

President : René Bouscatel.

Coaches : Guy NovÚs, Yannick Bru, Philippe Rougé-Thomas.

Ground : Stade Ernest-Wallon (19,500).

Heineken Cups : 1996, 2003 and 2005. Runners-up 2004, 2008.

Champions of France (17): 1912, 1922, 1923, 1924, 1926, 1927, 1947, 1985, 1986, 1989, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1999, 2001, 2008.

Challenge Yves-du-Manoir : 1934, 1988, 1993, 1995, 1998.

Fullbacks : M MĂ©dard, C Poitrenaud.

Wings : V Clerc, V Delasau (Fij), Y Donguy, C Heymans. Centres: M Ahotaeiloa (Ton), Y David, F Fritz, Y Jauzion, M Kunavore (Fij), R Lamerat.

Outhalves : J-M Doussain, F Michalak, D Skrela. Scrumhalves: N BĂ©zy, J-B Elissalde, B Kelleher (Nzl). Backrows: J Bouilhou, Q D’Aram de Valada, T Dusautoir, F Maka (Ton), Y Nyanga, L Picamoles, S Sowerby (Rsa), L ThuĂ©ry.

Secondrows : P Albacete (Arg), R Boukerou (Alg), G Lamboley, J Ledevedec, Y Maestri, R Millo-Chluski.

Hookers : V Lacombe, W Servat, A Vernet Basualdo (Arg).

Props : A Bousquet, C Givone, D Human (Rsa), C Johnston (Sam), B Lecouls, Y Montes, J-B Poux.

BIARRITZ OLYMPIQUE

Heineken Cup opponents : Munster.

Formed : 1902.

President : Serge Blanco.

Coaches : Jean-Michel Gonzalez, Jack Isaacs.

Ground : Parc des Sports Aguilera (15,000).

Colours : Red and white.

Heineken Cup : Finalists 2006 (lost to Munster).

French champions : 1935, 1939, 2002, 2005, 2006.

Challenge Yves-du-Manoir : 1937, 2000.

Fullbacks : I Balshaw (Eng), N Brusque, P Couet-Lannes.

Wings : P Bidabé, I Bolakoro (Fij), JB Gobelet,T Ngwenya (Zim).

Centres : M Bosch (Arg), A Erinle (Eng), Y Fior, C Gimenez, K Hunt (Aus), A Mignardi, D Traille, L Tranier.

Outhalves : V Courrent, J Peyrelongue.

Scrumhalves : Y Lesgourgues, D Yachvili.

Backrows : F Alexandre, F Faure, I Harinordoquy, R Lakafia, M Lund (Eng), T Molcard, P Taele-Pavihi (Sam).

Secondrows : M Carizza (Arg), C Damiani, T Hall (Rda), J-B Roidot, J Thion, Y Watremez.

Hookers : B August, B Denoyelle, B Geledan, A Raffault, R Terrain.

Props : F Barcella, A Barozzi, E Coetzee (Rsa), R Hughes, C Johnstone (Nzl), M Moala (Ton).

RUGBY CLUB TOULONNAIS

Challenge Cup opponents : Connacht.

Formed : 1908.

President : Mourad Boudjellal.

Coaches : Philippe Saint-André, Aubin Hueber, Tana Umaga (Nzl).

Colours : Red and black.

Ground : Stade FĂ©lix-Mayol (17,000).

French champions : 1931, 1987, 1992.

Champions of Pro D2 : 2005, 2008.

Challenge Yves-du-Manoir : 1934, 1970.

Fullbacks : C Barnard (Rsa), S Falconetti.

Wings : R Lamont (Sco), C Marienval, L Rooney (Aus), J Sinzelle, K Zagar.

Centres : M Kefu (Aus), C Loamanu (Jpn), G Lovobalavu (Fij), T May (Eng), T Pisi (Asa), JP Robinson (Wal), S Williams (Nzl).

Outhalves : R Barthélémy, F Contepomi (Arg), J Wilkinson (Eng).

Scrumhalves : F Cibray, A Giacobazzi, M Henjak (Aus), P Mignoni.

Backrows : F Auelua (Nzl) C Beal, J Braille, K Chesney (Eng), C Delarue, J El Abd (Eng), JM Fernandez Lobbe (Arg) O Missoup, H Senekal (Nam), T Sourice, J Van Niekerk (Rsa).

Secondrows : E Lozada (Bel), D Meyer Senekal (Rsa), R Skeate (Rsa), J Suta (Van).

Hookers : S Bruno, J Djoudi (Mar), P Fitzgerald (Sco), J-C Orioli.

Props : N Agnesi, B Bastùres, L Emmanuelli, D Kubriashvili (Geo), T Lea’aetoa (Nzl), T Ryan (Ire), S Taumoepeau (Tga).