I dont know mac, id say hes probably born and bred Kiwi but just uses the tongan passport for convenience and the work permit.
Cant believe IRFU hasnt made some effort to get himself and Warwick freed up to play for Ireland. They only played sevens. The greatest benefit would be felt by the island teams whos players get capped at 7s willy nilly by Oz NZ, hundreds of players lost to the islands Union side in this manner.
[quote=ādancarterā]I dont know mac, id say hes probably born and bred Kiwi but just uses the tongan passport for convenience and the work permit.
Cant believe IRFU hasnt made some effort to get himself and Warwick freed up to play for Ireland. They only played sevens. The greatest benefit would be felt by the island teams whos players get capped at 7s willy nilly by Oz NZ, hundreds of players lost to the islands Union side in this manner.[/quote]
Iām not sure whether itās a principled stance that has stopped the IRFU going after Mafi and Warwick but a bit surprised at the clamour to have them Irished-up on here.
Mafi is Tongan. Heās already gone for one flag of convenience when he chose to play representative rugby for New Zealand. There may be very good reasons for that and Iām not in any way criticising that decision - rugby players are economic migrants to New Zealand just like plenty of other Pacific Islanders in other trades.
But trying to get him to turn Irish is taking things a step too far. He has no connection with the country, he has an obvious entitlement to residency but he chose to become a Kiwi for the purposes of furthering his rugby career. Any change from that dilutes the rules for everyone. And it has been done in the past on special case appeals hasnāt it? Doesnāt make it right though.
[quote=ātherock67ā]Iām not sure whether itās a principled stance that has stopped the IRFU going after Mafi and Warwick but a bit surprised at the clamour to have them Irished-up on here.
Mafi is Tongan. Heās already gone for one flag of convenience when he chose to play representative rugby for New Zealand. There may be very good reasons for that and Iām not in any way criticising that decision - rugby players are economic migrants to New Zealand just like plenty of other Pacific Islanders in other trades.
But trying to get him to turn Irish is taking things a step too far. He has no connection with the country, he has an obvious entitlement to residency but he chose to become a Kiwi for the purposes of furthering his rugby career. Any change from that dilutes the rules for everyone. And it has been done in the past on special case appeals hasnāt it? Doesnāt make it right though.[/quote]
Definately not a principled stand by the IRFU; Boss, Manning, Brian Smith all those years ago would indicate otherwise. Simple as this they both are not qualified or they would be in the squad, simple as. Playing international rugby 7 is a disqualifying point.
I personally have no issue with playing either of them, Ireland may not have been there first choice but once 100% committment is given then fair enough. We didnt complain about it too much in Italia 90 and in rugby its an accepted practise, every team does it from NZ to USA.
Off top of my head Brad Thornes is a Kiwi who played RL for Oz, and then played for the All Blacks, different codes I know butā¦Clyde Rathbone captained SA U21s and then went on to play for Oz.
I touched on a point in my intitial post about this that if the sevens rule were relaxed the prime beneficiaries of it would be the Pacific Islands teams. It seems ridiculous to me that underage caps dont count but sevens caps do? What is this about?
Perhaps its coincedence but sevens would capture all the biggest fastest most skilful Islanders, one sevens cap and you can never represent your country at 15s.
I think NZ have taken a bit of a scattergun approach to capping players at this level, as have Oz, in an attempt to capture all the best young talent. Mafi played in 2005 NZ sevens squad, the only other player from the squad I recognise is Mana Ashford and only becauase he plays fos Landsdowne with my mate.
mafi was 21 when he made the decision to play 7s, he never thought of the consequences of it, if he hadnt come to Munster he would still be ineligible to play with Tonga, how much of an addition would he be to Tonga?!
BTW, I dont think Mafi is Tongan, he has a Tongan passport but I think hes NZ born and bred.
According to his wiki page he was born in Tonga on 15th August 1982. Also says he played underage for NZ at U19 and U21 - would that rule him out of ever playing for Ireland?
Boss had Irish grandparents though Dan didnt he? Thought Manning also had some connection.
Wiki (with all due respect to TFKwiki) is not always accurate. He may well be Tongan and I might be wrong about that but a Kiwi I know in Dublin played underage with Mafi and said he is a Kiwi. Many of the ahem ātannedā lads you see playing S14 would have pacific island heritage and as rocko said would be economic migrants e.g. Lomu, Umaga.
I am open to correction on Mafis birthplace though Mac.
Underage doesnt bar no, but sevens does. This is what I find so strange and makes me suspicious of the sevens rule.
Boss has irish connections, manning has only been qualified through residency and was brought over with the specific purpose of this (For all the good it will do!!!)
[quote=ādancarterā]Wiki (with all due respect to TFKwiki) is not always accurate. He may well be Tongan and I might be wrong about that but a Kiwi I know in Dublin played underage with Mafi and said he is a Kiwi. Many of the ahem ātannedā lads you see playing S14 would have pacific island heritage and as rocko said would be economic migrants e.g. Lomu, Umaga.
I am open to correction on Mafis birthplace though Mac.
Underage doesnt bar no, but sevens does. This is what I find so strange and makes me suspicious of the sevens rule.
Boss has irish connections, manning has only been qualified through residency and was brought over with the specific purpose of this (For all the good it will do!!!)[/quote]
What about his Bebo page Dan?! 
http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=6158686260
Munster Rugby site as well seems to agree
http://www.munsterrugby.ie/750_7375.php
What ever happened to Manning? There was a time when he was being lined up to challenge OāGara? Is he just useless?
Caqnt access that bebo page for some reason Mac but Il take your word for it. Doesnt change my argument that id let the wiry little punk wear the green in a heartbeat.
Manning isnt useless but hes a bit small and probably just not good enough to play for a top side. Id say he would get a lot of gametime with Connacht/Ulster and most teams in Mag lge/Premiership.
Again I like your close marking style mac, your keeping a very close eye on me recently
How about Ronan OāGara? Born in America
good point, Frankie Sheahan, Canada. The cannucks loss was Irelands gain 
I reckon we could get an Ireland XV of players that were born outside of Ireland, including A internationals of course.
Frankie, Boss, RoG, Payne to start with
payne never played at any level for irelandā¦
Check your facts again
consulted wikipedia and they have nothing on himā¦when did he represent ireland claremanā¦
Wikipedia isnāt a source of fact, he played Ireland āAā a few years back, I know cause I met him at a mates house house in Scariff 1 night before his first game, the slagging was good craic, heās a really sound bloke
Shaun is an out and out gentlemanā¦i meet him the odd time out and about, he is currnetly living in ballinaā¦
Sure he couldnāt get planning permission the good side of the bridge
Think the Puke is right, he was in a few squads definately but not sure he ever got capped??
there isnāt too many that can;)
fair enough clareman maybe Ireland A, just copped that there. Should have been more alright if he had landed a bit earlier