OGS is the man the bring Utd back to the summit â they should give him the job right now.
Looking at that City team, itâs very light on what one would call âleadersâ.
Vincent Kompany remains the real leader of the team, but heâs not playing an awful lot these days. De Bruyne is obviously the other big player they look to for on field leadership.
After that, in terms of leadership youâre talking about Delph, and heâs shit. On the face of it, Liverpool look to have a much more traditional dressing room eco-system, as it were, with several really big characters and leaders there - van Dijk, Milner, Henderson, Alisson etc, but Lovren, Robertson, Alexander-Arnold, Firmino, Wijnaldum and even Lallana seem much better characters with their own distinct personalities than most of the City players. The Ox is injured but heâs another one. The Liverpool dressing room just seems a much happier place with a much better mix where players are allowed to express their individual personalities in a way that City donât appear to be able to do.
It seems to be a thing with Guardiola teams that despite being able to win the majority of their games pretty easily, when an opponent really puts it up to them, they can often fold.
Is it that the focus on system he plays is so all consuming that when things start going against them, theyâre so enslaved to the system that they canât think on their feet?
Comebacks by Guardiola teams have been few and far between. Now, you may say thatâs because they rarely go behind, but thereâs undeniably a pattern there, especially in big European games.
I can think of four off the top of my head - Bayern Munich coming from 2-0 down to beat Juventus 4-2 in extra-time in the Champions League in 2016, Barcelona coming from 1-0 down to beat Real Madrid 3-1 in Madrid in 2011, the Chelsea game in 2009 when Iniesta scored at the end, and City recovering from trailing Monaco 2-0 and 3-1 to win 5-3 in the first leg of Champions League last 16 tie in 2017.
Against Monaco, they lost the second leg and went out of the competition, and they were very lucky against Chelsea in 2009 in a match they should have lost.
But I think of a lot more collapses and/or failures to turn things round when Guardiola teams went behind.
Inter 2010, at home against Madrid in the key Clasico in 2012, Bayernâs collapses against Madrid and Barcelona in 2014 and 2015, the loss to Atletico Madrid in 2016, City failing to Monaco in that second leg in 2017, the Liverpool collapse in the Champions League last April.
With City he has had a number of embarrassing collapses where teams scored at least three in quick succession against them - Chelsea and Leicester two seasons ago, Liverpool last January in the league, Manchester United in the league last April. There was a 4-0 defeat to Everton. Even in Barcelonaâs games away to Arsenal in 2010 and 2011, they capitulated twice and let in two second half goals in each.
Guardiola teams are fantastic when they get control of a game, but theyâre not great to dig results out.
Their next two games at Leicester and Southampton before the big showdown against Liverpool are massive, and real potential banana skins of the type that undid them two seasons ago. They got 78 points then, and while I fully expect them to beat that points total this time, I think we may be seeing a reversion to a sort of a half-way house between the previous two seasons. Since the start of December they have looked very fallible even in the games theyâve won and I think teams are not fearing them in the same way they did last season.
5 Likes
The Scot is there, need an Irish man alsoâŚ
Jaysus 
I think if you have the capability to really go after city, chase em down and press the shit out of them they can be broken. Hard to do though and thatâs why they generally beat teams they are better than comfortably. Usually then when they meet their peers they go defensive against them which suits city. But in Europe teams have gone at them and cracked them, Liverpool the same in the games theyâve played because Liverpool seem to only know one way.
Liverpool have good depth but if they lose Alisson, Van Dyke or Salah theyâll be in real trouble. The rest are interchangeable but the three lads are the core
2 Likes
Most teams are beaten before they kick off against City.
Be interesting to see after the Palace game now if teams will see a way to beat them
Away to Leicester next. Tricky one.
Itâs when Liverpool gas when the problems will arise, what happens when Salahâs hammy goes or Van Dijk starts getting exposed.
What really goes against the league is the lack of quality outside the top 6, very few outside it are capable of taking points off them.
Your own team Chelsea so far this season have roughly dropped points one in three matches against sides outside Top 6. So far this season, Chelsea have lost at home to Leicester, lost at Wolverhampton Wanderers and drawn with Everton and West Ham.
Last season Chelsea lost at home to Burnley and Bournemouth and lost at Watford, Newcastle, West Ham and Crystal Palace.
Teams outside Top 6 seem to take a lot of points off Chelsea.
1 Like
Why do you expect Liverpool to gas?
They didnât gas last season and the squad is stronger now.
Of the regular starters, Lovren and Henderson are the only ones that had really punishing World Cups. Firmino was a bit part player for Brazil, Salahâs World Cup never really got off the ground, Mane went out in the first round. Shaqiri was there with Switzerland but has been used sparingly with Liverpool. Alisson reached the quarter-finals with Brazil but goalkeepers arenât running around all the time.
Manchester City had more players who had punishing World Cups. De Bruyne and Kompany for Belgium. Walker, Stones and Sterling for England. Jesus and Fernandinho for Brazil, Otamendi and Aguero for Argentina, David Silva for Spain, Bernardo Silva for Portugal. Gundogan went out in the first round but had an emotionally draining experience because of off field events.
Kompany, De Bruyne, Aguero, Gundogan and Benjamin Mendy are all notoriously injury prone.
Of Liverpoolâs squad, Alexander-Arnold, van Dijk, Gomez, Matip, Robertson, Milner, Wijnaldum, Lallana, Keita, Fabinho, Sturridge and Moreno all had summers off and full pre-seasons. How many Manchester City players had that?
It was said above that if Liverpool lose van Dijk, Alisson or Salah theyâll be in trouble.
Thatâs about as insightful as saying that Chelsea would be in trouble if Hazard or Kante got injured, or Manchester City in trouble if De Bruyne or Silva got injured, or Barcelona if Messi got injured.
2 Likes
It was an odd comment, not quite as odd as the dismissing of VVD as a top class defender but still odd the day after Chelsea and City lost
He just hates Liverpool. Nothing to see here.
City havenât had KDB all season mate and have been doing fine. If Liverpool didnât have VVD for the start of the season theyâd probably be 4th
I think double Liverpoolâs total at the moment (96 points) will win this season. If Liverpool could go 15/3/2 in the next 20 games, they wonât be caught.
As the boys on MOTD said last night, the fella city canât replace is Fernadinho.
you need to grow as a person
They had him yesterday and lost.
If you go back two seasons, December was where Manchester City fell out of the title race with three league defeats.
The difference between Klopp and Guardiola is in their ability to learn. Klopp learned hugely from Liverpool tanking after Christmas two seasons ago. When Guardiola loses, he doubles down even further to a purer version of his vision. He has never won a close title race. His teams are like finely calibrated machines. Theyâre spectacular when firing, but introduce a few particles of dust, ie, in football terms, a challenger who doesnât fear them or respect them, and they can misfire very badly.
Liverpool have had virtually no soft tissue injuries so far this season. Henderson had a minor hamstring injury, which was not overly surprising given his exertions in the World Cup, but thatâs it. Gomez and Matip which have been the only significant injures so far were contact injuries to bones.
City have had soft tissue injuries all over the place.
Yet apparently itâs Liverpool who are going to tank.
2 Likes
Thatâs not a lot of points to drop.
1 Like