I’m not arguing for anything you said there, you made that up.
The correct approach would have been to have dedicated facilities to treat COVID-19 patients (as was done in Wuhan), this should still be done as we are likely to have COVID-19 patients for some time, maybe for many years or decades. As it is hospitals have been effectively dedicated to COVID-19 patients, ignoring other patients out of fear of infecting everyone, or people not going to hospitals at all out of fear of infection.
The issue is what to do going forward? Are you in favor of lock downs extending 6 months, a year or two years, if it means meeting your goal of as few as possible deaths?
Your answer is the specious reasoning one, as in wishful thinking.
I’m not in favour of anything except what we are doing now, for now.
As we scale up everything else, knowledge of the virus, antibody testing, icu capacity, contact tracing, and we get a clearer image of where we are, then we look at getting things running, with the proviso that if things spike, we can actively revert.
Putting an upper or lower limit on these things is ridiculous.
We don’t even need all of the above in place to get some things going again, but at the moment we have none
To do anything other than what’s listed here, would be to make the same mistakes you earlier harangued the government for, again.
How long is for now? You didn’t really answer the question re acceptable levels of deaths - just said as little as possible. As little as possible could mean 6 months, 12 months, 2 years lockdown. That’s ok is it, to achieve your ‘least amount as possible’ deaths from covid?
Whatever it takes to keep ICU from getting overwhelmed and people being buried in temporary mass graves. That’s not hysteria, its reality, right now, in New York.
When we get a handle on things, restrictions will be eased. We don’t have a handle on things. Easing restrictions now would be absolutely idiotic.
And before @anon7035031 comes in with his that won’t happen in Ireland because its sparsely populated, one quarter of our population (roughly) lives in a very condensed part of the east coast where unfortunately, most of the cases are occurring
What’s this mass graves in NYC stuff? Mass graves conjures up images of 100s or 1000s of people being shoved over in to death pits? Doesn’t sound like that from bbc report there.
Is ICU overwhelmed everywhere? No, it isn’t, it should therefore be looked at on a location by location basis, not by there’s ‘mass graves’ in NYC or look what happened in Italy three weeks ago.
What the utter psychopaths on this thread like @ironmoth, labane1917 and @Enrique are calling for is a siuation where our health system is completely overrun and that thousands upon thousands of people are condemned to death, whether they have or do not have COVID-19.
They don’t mention the mental toll on the families of their prospective victims, or on healthcare workers thrown into a nightmare not of their own making.
They do not offer strategies for how the elderly would cope or how they would avoid becoming ill in a situation where the virus is allowed to run like wildfire through the population.
They do not consider that there is as yet no firm evidence that herd immunity even exists.
They do not even offer any economic solutions, oblivious to the notion that a virus rampaging through the population will spread fear, panic and mass anger in society.
They offer nothing except death and destruction of real people’s lives, the same as the far right have always done.
Greed and selfishness do not begin to describe it. Psychopathic evil is the only reasonable description of the sick mindset behind it.
It isn’t overwhelmed everywhere, largely based on capacity and existing restrictions.
We have fuck all capacity, pretty much
Have a huge backlog on testing, definitely
Haven’t got huge contact tracing capabilities, definitely.
So you are denying people are being buried in paupers graves and arguing on semantics, despite posting a report that shows many people being buried in paupers graves. Did you see how long the trench is?
The report says 25 paupers a week are buried there before this? I’m not denying there’s now an increase but the increase is also due to the fact regular burials are now effectively banned. You’re mass graves language conjures up 100s or 1000s of people rolled into graves. That’s not semantics. It’s hysteria and hyberbole.
You place too much faith in what has been done to date, assuming it is working, and will continue to work. Some of it is helping to flatten the curve, but that’s it. Up to 80% (herd immunity at R0 of 5) of people will get infected, that’s the reality. Long before a vaccine is widely available. There may be only 1-5% infected currently.
The effort from early March was to try and contain the outbreak. We know now that containment was a pissing in the wind strategy, and mitigation was the only sensible approach. It is impossible to contain an outbreak of a virus that is effectively airborne and at least 50% of cases are asymptomatic, and maybe another 30% have mild symptoms. OK we didn’t know the airborne thing until recently, but we knew the asymptomatic issue early on. How can you contain such as an outbreak if infected people are walking around Tesco?
Mitigation involves getting people to change their habits, avoid close contact, wear masks, washing hands, etc. These measures work, against every respiratory disease. You will still get infections, but at a greatly reduced rate. Locking people up in their homes for months on end and destroying their hope will have far worse consequences, imo of course.
The numbers must be higher than 30%? The “mild” symptoms for 80% line came from testing of people with symptoms and some close contacts (I assume). That 50% is mostly likely walking around most countries, albeit in a restricted state.
Do you think the major governments have all conspired together along with all major news outlets to enforce these measures for some unforeseen gain on people?
There is an existing threat to public health, the likes of which haven’t been seen in over a century. This is a novel virus, the scientific community are scrambling to understand it, governments are crippled trying to keep people alive and health capacity manageable.
What exactly is your problem? What don’t you get? What don’t you believe.
I don’t think many on here are calling for a lock it down at all costs, that’s an argument that seems to have been fabricated by a few lads who want to open it up at all costs
Your arguments here are to rail against some mythical lock it down at all costs element and then cry hysteria and hyperbole when presented with some ugly truths.
He has such insight, he’s like that Republican Governor in Georgia who said he’d just found out there was such a thing as asymptomatic transmission of the virus, and that this knowledge was a “game changer”. This happened on April Fool’s Day.
