Watched most of this game and Sunderland really should have won it by a comfortable margin. The football was fairly average but they were crisper in the tackle and had most of the territory. Both sides’ passing was poor most of the time but Sunderland got into a lot of crossing positions and missed some gilt-edged headed chances. Jones was pretty impressive upfront again. Newcastle were quite clueless in truth and their goal came from one of those crosses that all the defenders were drawn to, but missed, and the ball crept in at the far post. Home points won’t be enough for Sunderland if they’re getting beaten away from home all the time.
When referring to the people, as opposed to the dialect, a definition of a Geordie is “a native or inhabitant of Newcastle upon Tyne, England, or its environs”,[2] so this can include North Tyneside (Wallsend, North Shields, Whitley Bay) (Walker), South Tyneside (Jarrow - such as the use in Alan Price’s ‘Jarrow Song’ [3], Hebburn, South Shields, Boldon), Gateshead such as the use in the Blaydon Races song [4],Newcastle such as the use in the Blaydon Races song [5], etc. akin to the way a Cockney is defined as “someone born within hearing distance of the Bow bells.” As the Cockney definition has been taken to mean within three miles of the church of St Mary-le-Bow on Cheapside,[citation needed] the Geordie definition, by some, has been taken to mean only Tyneside.[6] Another interpretation includes former areas of County Durham and Northumberland, including Ryton, Washington, etc. It must be noted that this particular definition of around the Tyne communities was not always the case, as Geordie has been documented for at least 180 to 240 years as meaning the whole of the North East of England.
In other words no mention of Sunderland whatsoever. Raven stick to facts, what’s your source for this crap? Highly irrelvant but it’s annoying when you’re wrong.
the whole of the north east includes sunderland
I guy I work with is from sunderland he told me first of all - then its on wikipedia & this atricle hear fleshes it out a bit more
When attending Sunderland matches in the mid-to-late-80s, every so often a chant would start: Geordies, Mackems, Geordies, Mackems and so it went on, each fan shouting a name that associates them with an area, but all with an unwavering support to the team they know and love. Today youll be lucky indeed to hear any such chant. Those brave enough to shout Geordies will receive a torrent of abuse or worse. My argument is this: Why do Sunderland need or have to be called Mackems?
I was brought up in Gateshead and have no connections at all with Sunderland, but to my black and white friends, Im a Mackem simply because I support the Lads. Can anyone give me a plausible explanation as to why Sunderland fans call themselves Mackems? As far as Im aware, it is a term which is fairly recent and was connected to the ship yard workers until they were closed for good in the late eighties. They would Mack and others would Tack the ships away from the Wear.
Would it be unkind to say that Sunderland fans adopted the tag Mackems because they needed an identity or a sense of belonging to the area, so that when someone said You sound like a Geordie, they could reply: No mate, Im a Mackem. Why does being called a Geordie rankle the red and white hordes so much? 20-30 years ago when the away fans would sing songs associating Sunderland with Geordies, no-ne appeared to care less. It is only in recent years that fans have started to distance themselves from the Geordie tag, and though I can see why the people of Sunderland needed a tag (to unite them and create a regional identity) why they waited over a century to call themselves Mackems which was originally a derogatory term in any case, is anyone’s guess.
Apparently the term Geordie covers a wide area. When researching this fact (I use the term research in its broadest context), I found that Geordie, refers to anyone who is born either on the North or South of the Tyne from a far as Prudhoe to the coastline and North and South Shields, down to Jarrow and Hebburn. In the Bonnie Prince Charlie rebellion in 1845 you were either for Charlie, a Jacobite for the Catholics and the Stuart cause, or else you were a Geordie for the protestant King George of Hanover. When the keelmen went down to London with their keels full of coals from Newcastle they were asked, Are you a Charlie or a Geordie? Nowadays, to get along as a Geordie playing for Sunderland, it helps never to have a bad game, and also not to wear offensive T-shirts calling the fans who pay your wages, isnt that right Mr Clark?
Recently, there has been an explosion around the concept of identity. Since Sunderland, Newcastle and the surrounding areas became Tyne and Wear, each city has been keen to distance itself from the other (some would argue favouritism towards Newcastle when it comes to spending the taxpayers money). Identities are all about questions of using the resources of history, language and culture in the process of becoming rather than being. Not who we are or where we come from, so much as what we might become, how we have been represented and how that bears on how we might represent ourselves.
If a Sunderland fan, or any other who wishes to beat their chests and remonstrate about the merits of their club and their city then fine. Are we in danger then of fencing off other identities simply to preserve our own, or to keep others out? Personally, I think the Mackem tag is outdated after only a few years of being used. Apart from the Nissan car factory based in Washington, what other commodities does Sunderland export? There is no glass anymore, save for what the new glass centre has to offer and there is little happening down on the Wear. So what do others make and others take? Not a lot.
Let us look at the facts. In the 80s, Newcastle, Sunderland and the North East in general were ravaged by job losses and high unemployment as well as being ramshackle and generally run down. The football clubs were the same. 15-20,000 hardcore fans watching sub-standard teams in sub-standard (crap) stadiums. Then things started to change. While Sunderland was coming to terms with the loss of its shipyards, Newcastle started its regeneration - Eldon Square, the Quayside, the city centre. Then came Keegan, McDermott and Hall, a rebuilt ground, party city and before you know it, Newcastle is the official regional centre of the North East and the eighth best place to visit for a night out in the world. Sunderland, well its a cracking night out and everything, but can it honestly compete?
Newcastle has also had a lot of media attention over the years, or celebrities falling over themselves to be re-associatd with their so called roots. Jayne Middlemiss, Ant and Dec, Jimmy Nail, Old Uncle Tom Cobbly and all. The rise and rise of Newcastle FC in the 90s has riled all things red and white. The entertainers, European qualification, is it any wonder that the people of Sunderland and fans of the club in general might feel left out, soulless without sense of belonging? The tension is at its highest between the two cities as they clamour to better each other.
Football has always been a working class game. In past generations its players and fans generally came from working class backgrounds. The bulk of football crowds today is made up of those fans on lower incomes. The advent of all seater stadia and increased admission prices is making it harder for these fans to attend games. The English working class is not a thing. It has always been a historical relationship of unity and difference. It unites one class against the other, or in football terms, one set of supporters against the other. We need to feel wanted.
A sense of belonging is necessary when attaching someone to a football club or an area; not the so called return to ‘roots’ but a coming to terms with our ‘routes.’ What does the future hold? Do we need the term Mackem or are there any suitable alternatives? There are a number of questions to answer
also up till recently all people from the north east of england were termed geordies- only recently that changed - good way to piss off a mackem is to call him a georide which is correct according to some definitions
therock67 wrote:
In other words no mention of Sunderland whatsoever. Raven stick to facts, what’s your source for this crap? Highly irrelvant but it’s annoying when you’re wrong.
rock- admit you got this wrong - admit that I provided some definitions
An article with no source, references to Wikipedia… come on Raven. When you provide a real source I’ll consider that source’s argument. At the moment all you have is “copy and paste” from the Betfair forum.
therock67 wrote:
An article with no source, references to Wikipedia… come on Raven. When you provide a real source I’ll consider that source’s argument. At the moment all you have is “copy and paste” from the Betfair forum.
Still waiting Raven. For the moment I’ll assume you were wrong.
i said according to some definitions-
wikipedia is one &a love supreme fanzine
waiting for the apology
Still no credible source Raven. All wrong again. That’s 3 threads in a row where you’ve made monumental errors. Maybe time to take a break for a couple of days and get your head together.
so very rocko to post a definitive article on who’s a macken and who’s a geordie.