not much discussion about it here. for my own perspective, ill be voting yes to the judicial pay one even though i dont think a referendum is required and no to the abbeylara one as the wording is far too vague and gives the oireachteas too much power.
i think both referenda are too vague, rushed and with little enough debate
I’ll be going yes on the Judges, pack of cunts.
Not sure on the 2nd one. I don’t like all the money paid on Tribunals but also I don’t like the idea of Mattie McGrath deciding on something other than the length of shooting season and/or if the hour should go back at winter or not.
No and No. Both are attacks on essential checks and balances necessary to protect individuals from the machinery of the State.
No & No here too. I’d be wavering on the judges one as they are overpaid like every aspect of the higher echelons of the public sector but I don’t believe the govt should dictate what they are paid if they are truly independent. Of course the Phillip Sheedy case shows that they are not but thats a differenct debate.
The Oireachtas committee vote should be a non runner after the way Callelly’s hearing was handled. I’d prefer a seperate referrendum limiting the amount of fees the legal profession can make from a public enquiry but I’d prefer them handling it than the fools who pass as our betters in Leinster house.
Regarding the proposed Oireachtas powers, what are the equivalent mechanisms in the UK and the US?
I too would be apprehensive about too much power being invested in the goons in Leinster House, but at the same time I’d be conscious of the hysteria of the pseudo-libertarian crackpots who regard vat as a form of oppression.
ill be voting no to judicial pay & yes to the abbeylara one- just because fooley is doing the opposite
Hysterical nonsense There’s isn’t one reason why judges should not be subject to pay reductions the same as everybody else.
[quote=“sid waddell, post: 629938”]
Hysterical nonsense There’s isn’t one reason why judges should not be subject to pay reductions the same as everybody else.
[/quote]Yeah you think so do you Sid.
Good for you.
Fagan wins the argument with that devasting rebuttal.
dp
thanks buddy. hope the family is keeping well
in relation to judicial independence, you can easily trace the political dna in nost judges e.g brian lenihans wife appointed by brian lenihan or albert reynolds daughter. the judge’s made no pronouncements when the govt kept increasing their pay which could have been viewed as buying the judiciary. the real problem is that a few judges are up to their neck in property deals gone bad and a few of them could be bankrupted if their pay drops
[quote=“sid waddell, post: 629940”]
Fagan wins the argument with that devasting rebuttal.
[/quote]Why the fuck would I waste my breath arguing with you. I was asked for my opinion and gave it. What the fuck does it have to do with you? Jaysus you’d swear you were some kind of expert on constitutional law rather than a clown on a bike with a penchant for bad puns.
The judiciary’s whole argument is that their independence and impartiality could be compromised if their pay is reduced. It’s actually laughable, Effectively their saying “we threaten to be corruptible if you reduce our pay”. The people making this argument have no business in the judiciary in the first place.
You seem to be having a tough day Fagan. There there.
i agree with Fagan here.
the judicary have to remain independent, a pay freeze would be more suitable than a cut.
regarding what art said in relation to judges Dna, its very true two recent apointess to the high court were appointed as judges when
labour and FG were last in power.
Re abbeylara, another attack on the constitution, you cannot delegate judicial power to a non judicial body allied with this is the fact that most lads in leinster house would porbably only use it for caning the opposition.
Could someone give me a brief summary on what the non judge related referendum is about? Make it easy so a simpleton like me can understand.
The level of their pay should nothing to do with this. If it does they are in the wrong profession.
[quote=“Mac, post: 629947”]
Could someone give me a brief summary on what the non judge related referendum is about? Make it easy so a simpleton like me can understand.
[/quote]Is it any wonder Sean Gallagher is going to be President when chumps like this have a vote?
Would you prefer if I voted without asking for the details first?
[quote=“Mac, post: 629950”]
Would you prefer if I voted without asking for the details first?
[/quote]You might as well if you are going to be relying on the idiots on this site to make up your mind for you.