He is the foremost academic who has studied the history of genocides committed by governments since the beginning of the 20th century. I realize it makes for difficult reading for socialists like yourself. Yes indeed, governments have done a stellar job protecting people’s freedoms, so much so that they murdered hundreds of millions. Who orchestrated the killing if it wasn’t governments?
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Because they are not socialist. Capitalism is still the economic system in western Europe, even though it is under increasing pressure from socialist nutters.
That’ll be news to all the socialist parties in Europe. Socialism and capitalism can coexist. Another simple fact you are choosing to deny.
Read carefully now: greater government intervention in developed democratic countries leads to greater levels of personal freedom.
China - A planned economy, a mix of socialism and capitalism probably closest to facism in that the state allows nominal private ownership of companies but maintains overall control
USSR no longer exists but was a communist dictatorship
Nazi Germany - was a fascist dictatorship. They used the word socialist in the title of the party but it was about as socialist as the US was communist.
Cambodia - I presume you are referring to the Khmer Rouge time here, was a nominally communist government
Vietnam again communist
Eastern Europe was communist also at least I presume that’s the period you are referring to.
So of your list of countries that you asked whether they were socialist or capitalist I’m afraid the answer is neither in any case.
Are you in the US that long that you’ve fallen into the socialism is communism trap? Because it isn’t mate
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How many deaths is the US government directly responsible for? Or are we just keeping track of socialists?
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Nope mate, they are incompatible as economic systems. You are confusing socialism with social democracy. Nobody, or at least no reasonable person, objects to social programs to improve the quality of life of the young and old, and the physically or mentally unwell. Social programs are made possible by wealth created by capitalism and capitalist.
Do you think socialism can create wealth? Give me one example where socialism as an economic system has created wealth.
…and you’ve fallen for the pinko socialist lie that the next time we’ll get it right.
I’m referencing economic systems, communism is a political system.
Yet again, you are trying to define words and thereby define the argument. Not having it. You’re wrong.
Unjustifiable deaths? You can hardly argue intervention in WWII whether Europe or Pacific was unjustified. Protecting capitalism against the spread of communism, given the savage history of communist regimes, was justified in my opinion. ME policy totally misguided, but Europe is the primary beneficiary of keeping ME oil and gas flowing.
In terms of economics, socialism is defined as common ownership of the means of production. “Common” ownership is impossible and unworkable, which is why economic socialist regimes always results in state ownership (as the state knows best 
). If you don’t understand that basic tenet of socialism, then it’s no wonder you have such a confused existence.
You’re trying to define terms again to suit yourself. You’re trying to tell us all the socialist parties in europe are not socialists, to suit yourself.
Stop. It’s embarrassing.
They are not socialist, and the proof is when they get into power they by and large act as capitalists, exactly as the Democrats do in the US. How socialist have the Labour party been in Ireland when in government? There have been socialist parties elected to power in Europe, France for example. Which one has confiscated all private property and industry and divided it up among the proletariat? That’s what they would do if they were socialists, mate, you know like Venezuela where it has worked so well.
Labour in Ireland have never even been a left wing party in my lifetime at least.
But, either all of the actual socialist parties that call their parties “the socialist party” or similar, and that call themselves socialists, and that millions of people vote for, are wrong, or you are.
Which is more likely? All the socialist parties and the millions that vote for them are wrong, or the lad on the Internet who is gullible enough to get duped by a google image of a big fry? I know where my money is.
And the capitalists have got it right? Only for massive global government intervention in 2008 the whole capitalist system would have collapsed. The single greatest destruction of capital ever or at least since the last time the capitalists blew up the World before that.
The rise of Communism in Russia was directly caused by the abject failures of capitalism, concentration of wealth, poor working conditions, poor wages etc.
The rise of Facism in Germany was directly caused by the abject failures of capitalism (and the greed of the allies). No jobs, no prospects, no way to improve yourself. Fuck it let’s give this Hitler lunatic a go, couldn’t be worse (see Trump).
The rise of communism in Vietnam, Cambodia and China the same. I could go on but what is the point, in summary every single failed communist/facist/socialist state was a failed capitalist state before hand. The failures of capitalism cause Socialism.
If it wasn’t for communists and socialists the World over, there would have been few if any improvements made to workers lives, no free education, no free healthcare, no workers rights, no workplace safety etc etc etc. Capitalist society’s by design concentrate the wealth and the power in the hands of the few. With your current frame of thinking you’d have been on the business owners side in the 1913 lockout.
What we’ve seen in the last few decades in the US, UK etc is the rolling back of hard won social reforms in order to maximise profits, pay for college, healthcare in the US being completely unaffordable etc. Smashing of trade unions meaning the outsourcing of jobs to the lowest bidder. High paid workers replaced by low paid ones to maximise profits.
But don’t worry the wheel will turn again, and socialism will be looked at again in all the countries failed by capitalism.
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The US certainly prevented communism in Vietnam, North Korea and Cambodia oh wait. Although to be fair they did prevent it spreading to Afghanistan, Chile and Panama. Now to do so they installed two dictators and the Taliban who proceeded to steal all the wealth of the country, suppress free speech and murder all their political opponents but at least it wasn’t communism
Double oooft!
The millions that vote for them obviously…
Good response. I have to go to the pub now in my ongoing preparation for Sept 3rd, but will get back to you after I’ve had a few.
Take your time mate. Enjoy the pints
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