Fine Gael - Hugging The Touchline On The Right Wing?


#1

What’s the story with these lads? Firstly, they proposed to segregate foreign students in the classroom and now they suggest paying foreign nationals to return home. Hopefully, Leo will eventually get his wish for a pure Irish race. Idiot.

Outrage as FG suggests paying foreign workers to return home

Friday September 05 2008

A Fine Gael proposal to give unemployed foreign nationals six months’ free dole in exchange for going home was yesterday strongly criticised by Fianna Fail and FAS.

A voluntary repatriation scheme for the 40,000 foreign nationals on the live register was mooted by Fine Gael enterprise spokesman Leo Varadkar, at a meeting of the Oireachtas enterprise committee with FAS, the Irish National Organisation of the Unemployed and Enterprise Ireland.

His proposal centred on the idea that six months of social welfare benefits be paid to foreign national workers prepared to return to their country of origin. Such workers cost the State 400m every year in dole payments, according to Mr Varadkar. But Fianna Fail’s Thomas Byrne labelled the proposal as a “new low in Irish politics”.

Director General of FAS Rody Molloy also rejected the idea, warning that Fine Gael needed to tread very carefully when it came to ensuring that all citizens, regardless of nationality, received equal rights.

The exchange of hostile words during yesterday’s meeting followed the publication of live register figures showing 247,384 people signing on for benefits in August, an increase of 73,178 in the last 12 months.

Voluntary

Stressing that any repatriation scheme would be strictly voluntary, Mr Varadkar said it would merely provide unemployed foreign workers with an alternative option.

The Fine Gael frontbench spokesman said that in two years, Ireland could potentially have one of the highest unemployment rates in the EU. While some European countries were reducing their unemployment levels and pulling down the average rate to 6.8pc, Ireland’s rate had increased to 6.1pc and was bucking the trend, he argued.

However, FAS shot down the suggestion and argued that all nationalities should have the same rights as Irish citizens.

“That’s the beginning and end for me in the sense of rights,” Mr Molloy said.

He also argued that it was in Ireland’s interests to operate a social welfare system which treated everyone equally so that Irish people abroad who were unemployed could expect to be treated fairly.

The FAS chief added that he would be “very nervous” about anything which would take away from a citizen’s rights, and queried just how voluntary such a repatriation scheme could be.

Questions were also raised about what would happen in the event of a worker returning home only to come back three weeks later. “You have to tread very carefully not to tread on people’s rights,” Mr Molloy said.

Fianna Fail backbencher Thomas Byrne accused Mr Varadkar of setting a “new low” in Irish politics with such a proposal and asked him to withdraw his remarks. “It’s a very dangerous proposal and sets a new low in Irish politics. It’s a repetition of what Fine Gael are at in recent weeks. It’s very dangerous,” he said, referring to recent comments by the party’s education spokesman on “segregating” children to learn English.

Mr Varadkar’s proposal follows the introduction of a scheme in Spain where unemployed foreign workers can volunteer to return to their home countries.


#2

When the bishops blessed the blue shirts in Dun Laoghaire,
They sailed beneath a swastika to Spain…


#3

I wonder does Leo’s dad still have his surgery. Because if he’s retired and living off our welfare state we should send him the fuck back to India.

I cannot believe that FG think this is the way forward for them as a party. They’re up their own holes with this superior righteous way of protecting the country and genuinely seem to believe that there’s a need for a Grand Old Party in Ireland. That Varadkar the utter cunt has Joe Higgins’ seat suggests there is a local market for this sort of myopia but thankfully most people have enough sense to see beyond the populism.

Any clown can see that they can position themselves as centrist with an economic and corruption reform agenda that would allow them to strengthen their hand. But instead they go after cheap, crass and downright insulting publicity stunts that appeal to the lowest common denominator and hark back to Blueshirts and obedience and all the other fucking crap that O’Duffy and his comrades brought to Ireland.

It would nearly make you want to vote FF just to give these guys the right sort of message.


#4

Their lack of policies apart from the “we’re not Fianna Fil” one wasn’t serving them well so they seem to be looking for a gap in the market. There doesn’t seem to be any other anti-foreigner party out there so that’ll be their USP for a while.

Can I get six months dole to fuck off for a while? I won’t come back 'til the recession’s over.


#5

Saw Varadkar’s comments on the news last night and remembered farmer’s comments about him. Seems to be an absolute clown. That other FG TD Tom English fella who he was sitting beside annoys me too. He is obviously appealing to the pro war in Iraq, anti-foreigner, anti-nationalist, pro Gay Mitchell’s haircut wing of the party. At least Byrne shot him down quickly.


#6

this is the problem with the whole immigration issue

according to either camp you are either a xenophobe & racist or a treehugging, elderberry smelling, sandal wearing pinko

FG, against all expectation, have for once brought up a valid issue except they have’nt had the cojones to say exactly what the problem is and have left themselves wide open to accusations of Nazism

here’s the issues and my spin on them:

firstly I have no problem with genuine asylum seekers whose lives are in imminent danger and secondly I have absolutely no problem with people who come here to work

these issues that varadakar alludes to is for people who have’nt bothered to do a days work since they arrived, these people should be fucked out straight away along with our indiigenous wasters as they are a massive drain on our health, welfare and law and order systems.

secondly, they should be sending immigrants back to their point of origin to the EU, normally spain or italy as that is where they should be claiming asylum.

and finally onto the schools side of things, if you have a class of 26 kids and of that 4 are non englishh speakers then the pace of the classwill be dictated by the 4 slowest learners, it’s not fair to the non english speakers and it’s not fair to the others as well, in fact everyone loses out, the best way of doing it is to have the kids in a class in which they will have taught to suit their pace and this means a better and fuller integration at a later stage, maybe 2 or 3 years

but I suppose saying this makes me a xenophobe


#7

Belter of a line right there.

Having read a few of you deride Leo on here before for being an absolute charlatan and a loose cannon, what I wonder is if he’s making these outlandish proposals off his own bat or is this the best Fine Gael as a party can come up with?

It would be worrying enough if the party had allowed this gobshite to go forward as a candidate in the election and then made him a opposition front bench spokesman after he somehow won a seat. But I could probably pass it off as an isolated case of terribly poor judgement on their part.

However, if this is what the Fine Gael collective brains trust has come up with as policies to bring to the electorate then they can fook off with themselves. The racist cunts.


#8

[quote=“artfoley”]this is the problem with the whole immigration issue

according to either camp you are either a xenophobe & racist or a treehugging, elderberry smelling, sandal wearing pinko

FG, against all expectation, have for once brought up a valid issue except they have’nt had the cojones to say exactly what the problem is and have left themselves wide open to accusations of Nazism

here’s the issues and my spin on them:

firstly I have no problem with genuine asylum seekers whose lives are in imminent danger and secondly I have absolutely no problem with people who come here to work

these issues that varadakar alludes to is for people who have’nt bothered to do a days work since they arrived, these people should be fucked out straight away along with our indiigenous wasters as they are a massive drain on our health, welfare and law and order systems.

secondly, they should be sending immigrants back to their point of origin to the EU, normally spain or italy as that is where they should be claiming asylum.

and finally onto the schools side of things, if you have a class of 26 kids and of that 4 are non englishh speakers then the pace of the classwill be dictated by the 4 slowest learners, it’s not fair to the non english speakers and it’s not fair to the others as well, in fact everyone loses out, the best way of doing it is to have the kids in a class in which they will have taught to suit their pace and this means a better and fuller integration at a later stage, maybe 2 or 3 years

but I suppose saying this makes me a xenophobe[/quote]

xenophobe

you have no problem with people coming here to work?? wtf - how generous & open minded of you
& what about the less bright kids - should they be separated too as they are holding up the class


#9

[quote=“north county corncrake”]xenophobe

you have no problem with people coming here to work?? wtf - how gerous & open minded of you[/quote]

yep, people who want to contribute to our society be they immigrants or indigenous are more than welcome

those who want to sit on their fat hairy holes while the rest of us are out wotking to support them can fuck off

is that simple enough for you or would you like a diagram ?


#10

Poor old Art aint no xenophobe, he’s just blue dyed fine gaeler.


#11

am i fuck
I would’nt vote for any of the major parties. they’re all as bent,shite and useless as each other with no morals or sense of decency


#12

[quote=“artfoley”]am i fuck
I would’nt vote for any of the major parties. they’re all as bent,shite and useless as each other with no morals or sense of decency[/quote]

I stand corrected


#13

[quote=“artfoley”]this is the problem with the whole immigration issue

according to either camp you are either a xenophobe & racist or a treehugging, elderberry smelling, sandal wearing pinko

FG, against all expectation, have for once brought up a valid issue except they have’nt had the cojones to say exactly what the problem is and have left themselves wide open to accusations of Nazism

here’s the issues and my spin on them:

firstly I have no problem with genuine asylum seekers whose lives are in imminent danger and secondly I have absolutely no problem with people who come here to work

these issues that varadakar alludes to is for people who have’nt bothered to do a days work since they arrived, these people should be fucked out straight away along with our indiigenous wasters as they are a massive drain on our health, welfare and law and order systems.

secondly, they should be sending immigrants back to their point of origin to the EU, normally spain or italy as that is where they should be claiming asylum.

and finally onto the schools side of things, if you have a class of 26 kids and of that 4 are non englishh speakers then the pace of the classwill be dictated by the 4 slowest learners, it’s not fair to the non english speakers and it’s not fair to the others as well, in fact everyone loses out, the best way of doing it is to have the kids in a class in which they will have taught to suit their pace and this means a better and fuller integration at a later stage, maybe 2 or 3 years

but I suppose saying this makes me a xenophobe[/quote]

Always very dangerous to talk about something you don’t understand Art. Trying to come across all reasonable and balanced but you’re just throwing out random Daily Mail style phrases.

Of course the biggest flaw with your argument above is that asylum seekers who arrived in this country after 1999 are not allowed to work. So you can’t not have a problem with asylum seekers and then say that you only accept those who come here and work. Can’t happen I’m afraid. (And maybe a more progressive change would be to alter that law and allow asylum seekers to get employment here).

The other people who have arrived here and haven’t done a day’s work - who are these people exactly? Do you think we have a huge influx of people who come here without visas and gain entry somehow and don’t work? Where are these people all day? There were 16,000 immigrants to Ireland from outside the EU last year. That includes asylum seekers who can’t work - about 4,000 of them. So there are 12,000 net immigrants, 2,000 of whom are from the US.

The schools thing is a load of utter shite as well. Primary schools aren’t streamed because every statistic from every study ever conducted tells you that it is more beneficial to have different learning abilities in the same classes. You’re deluding only yourself if you think that separating immigrants into separate classes will help them integrate better.


#14

[quote=“therock67”]Always very dangerous to talk about something you don’t understand Art. Trying to come across all reasonable and balanced but you’re just throwing out random Daily Mail style phrases.

Of course the biggest flaw with your argument above is that asylum seekers who arrived in this country after 1999 are not allowed to work. So you can’t not have a problem with asylum seekers and then say that you only accept those who come here and work. Can’t happen I’m afraid. (And maybe a more progressive change would be to alter that law and allow asylum seekers to get employment here).

The other people who have arrived here and haven’t done a day’s work - who are these people exactly? Do you think we have a huge influx of people who come here without visas and gain entry somehow and don’t work? Where are these people all day? There were 16,000 immigrants to Ireland from outside the EU last year. That includes asylum seekers who can’t work - about 4,000 of them. So there are 12,000 net immigrants, 2,000 of whom are from the US.

The schools thing is a load of utter shite as well. Primary schools aren’t streamed because every statistic from every study ever conducted tells you that it is more beneficial to have different learning abilities in the same classes. You’re deluding only yourself if you think that separating immigrants into separate classes will help them integrate better.[/quote]

sorry rock but I have infinitely more knowledge of the asylum system than you give me credit for through work and it’s people like yourself who think they know the story who are tempering this debate when they have very little idea what is going on

compare the number of asylum seekers who are not on the live register with the amount of non eu foreign nationals who are on the live register
or look up the number of asylum applications that have been granted compared with the number of non eu nationals on the live register

if you can’t find them now I’ll get them from work on monday

and as for the teaching that is coming from a number of people who are primary teachers


#15

[quote=“artfoley”]sorry rock but I have infinitely more knowledge of the asylum system than you give me credit for through work and it’s people like yourself who think they know the story who are tempering this debate when they have very little idea what is going on

compare the number of asylum seekers who are not on the live register with the amount of non eu foreign nationals who are on the live register
or look up the number of asylum applications that have been granted compared with the number of non eu nationals on the live register

if you can’t find them now I’ll get them from work on monday

and as for the teaching that is coming from a number of people who are primary teachers[/quote]

I’m a teacher and I think your point on segragation is ridiculous. Way to integrate these children into schools is to ensure they mix with Irish children and other children who have English as their first language. It is not just good for the non English speaking children but also for the English speaking children as they can mix with children of a different social/ethnic background. While these children would of course benefit from having a resource teacher to assist them in learning English this would be done in conjunction with their mainstream class experience and not in separation.


#16

[quote=“artfoley”]sorry rock but I have infinitely more knowledge of the asylum system than you give me credit for through work and it’s people like yourself who think they know the story who are tempering this debate when they have very little idea what is going on

compare the number of asylum seekers who are not on the live register with the amount of non eu foreign nationals who are on the live register
or look up the number of asylum applications that have been granted compared with the number of non eu nationals on the live register

if you can’t find them now I’ll get them from work on monday

and as for the teaching that is coming from a number of people who are primary teachers[/quote]

Well your “knowledge” looks ridiculous to be frank when you talk about asylum seekers coming here and not working. I’ve explained a simple fact to you - namely that asylum seekers are not permitted to work - and all you can respond with is that you know more about this then I think you do. Frankly that’s not terribly convincing.

That is also absolutely central to your spurious claims about the number of asylum seekers on the live register. I’ll reiterate: Ireland does not allow asylum seekers to work. They have no other option other than to receive welfare from the state.

I also know a number of primary teachers - and I can assure you the last thing they want is to have immigrants in a separate class. At least you’re no longer trying to dress it up as being good for integration anyway!


#17

Teachers might want segregation as it would make their job easier. It doesn’t help the kids though.

Mixed ability helps in numerous ways e.g. the ‘stronger’ kids can help the weaker ones which increases their understanding as opposed to just their knowledge of a topic as well as helping everybody mix and learn from each other.

If the class is dictated to by the 4 slower learners the teacher’s not up to scratch. It is quite possible to teach a group of varying levels. Open tasks can be set which means each student works to his/her own level. Different tasks can be given to different students to make comparisons difficult.


#18

First Leo opens Féile an phobail, now this. Has fine gael found someone with a set, or are they being provided by Mary Lou?


#19

Coveney is a big part of it… But it’s like both FF and FG have woken up to the north and the potential to expand their parties into the six…has there been any more chat of FF running in next local elections? But it does feel like elements in FG see that a united Ireland is viable and they are up for it… it could also be all PR fluff to look like real leadership.


#20

It’s some precedent to set. May is making noises about an amnesty for the security forces. It might be a shot across the bow in relation to brexit negotiations. There ate plenty of other cass of worms.