Liverpool - not 2009/10 but the next season after that

Sport
641

:o :lol:

More than over the top, iā€™ve actually seen them 3 times in a week funnily enough, but thats not really the point. I was judging him on yesterday, and he has made clear improvements in technique. Heā€™s also a bit smarter than iā€™d seen him before, while working hard, he didnā€™t get pulled out of position too much, leaving holes.

I donā€™t have to be a Pool supporter to see these things farmer. You have your mind closed on him clearly, and will only see the negatives. We can all be accused of such things with sportsmen sometimes. Iā€™d hold my hands up on Paddy Wallace for instance in rugby, was not looking at his strengths enough. Of course Lucas would have to continue in this veign and keep improving to really have an impact. But he has improved, to say anything else is just out and out ignorance.

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Iā€™ll have to agree with Kev here. A performance like that from Mascherano in months gone by would have yielded unheralded praise. He (Lucas) has been much improved over the last month or so and has played as much a part as Torres and Gerard for the recent run of success. Lets give credit where credit is due here. Ok, you canā€™t forget how shite he has been up to now either but lets give the lad a break, eh Farmer ?

643

With regards to the improvement point, I think for someone to be classed as having improved, then it needs to be consistent performances of longer than a week.

Also Lucas has been around a long time now, and he has never really improved since he first joined. As I posted previously I feel he lacks most of the basic attributes one should possess to be considered a good midfielder. While he showed plenty of effort yesterday, he gave away the ball a lot needlessly (in fairness so did most of the midfield for a spell there in the second half), and I would certainly hold judgement for a while longer to say he has improved.

My overall point is that sometimes when a player has been around for a considerable length, and has operated at a poor standard during that time, I would doubt their ability to suddenly improve. Lucas did alright against Chelsea but Iā€™ll hold off for longer before I wll say that he has improved.

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He has been ok in the last month CM - I wouldnā€™t say that he has been much improved at all. But that is my view and maybe there could be an element of being blinded by his uselessness down the years.

645

Im with Farmer here and agree on his points, even though I felt Lucas was outstanding yesterday heā€™s still a very average player and if a half decent offer was made in January he should be cashed in because heā€™ll never be a brilliant player and will play poorly more times then not.

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I hear you Farmerā€¦ but in these dark times we all need a heroā€¦ The cult of Lucas is here and here to stay. We talked about needing to get ugly a while back and Lucas clearly has ALL the attributes here. He may never be a world beater but his work rate and enthusiasm to stick the boot in will do nicely at present.

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Did ya not watch the youtube video posted farmer? Thatā€™s surely every time he came near the ball in the match and it looks like he gave it away fuck all as well as playing some lovely passes and putting in a nice few tackles. Even a couple of those times he gave were trying a ball which he was probably right to but just didnā€™t come off. Give credit where credit was due it looked like a very good midfield performance on first viewing and that youtube clip proves it. He is usually shit youā€™re right but not yesterday.
Great idea that thing by the way, would be really interesting to see more of that kind of highlights package of individual players would save time on a lot of long winded arguments about fellas favourites/pet hates. Does the same fella do a lot of them?

648

John Henry got himself the ā€œbargain of the centuryā€
This is a steal,ā€ said Marc Ganis, a Chicago-based consultant who was hired by a Chinese group negotiating to buy the club. There is a reason John Henry was so eager to close this deal ā€“ he got himself the bargain of the century.ā€

ā€œTwo bankers who requested anonymity say that, under ordinary circumstances, the team would have been worth an additional 100 million to 150 million pounds. In five years, it may be worth twice as much, they said.ā€

"Hicks and Gillett increased sales 46 percent to 195.5 million pounds in three years through July 31 and raised operating profit ā€“ which doesnā€™t include interest on debt or player acquisition costs ā€“ more than threefold to 32 million pounds.

Liverpool may surpass 200 million pounds in revenue for the first time at the end of the current season, though audited financial reports for fiscal 2010 wonā€™t be available until April."

"Broughton said the teamā€™s problems were caused by a reliance on debt by Hicks and Gillett, not lack of operational acumen.
The commercial revenue was way higher than what it was before,ā€ Broughton said. ā€œTheyā€™ve done some pretty good things. Without the leverage they could have been successful.ā€

ā€œLiverpoolā€™s revenue from sponsorships and merchandise for fiscal 2009 was the second highest in the Premier League at 67.7 million pounds, trailing only Manchester United (70 million pounds), Deloitte said.ā€

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1-1 tonight with Wigan.

Thatā€™s shite.

650

That was absolutely dire tonightā€¦ Liverpool were abysmal. Just when I thought we had turned a corner and that roy had got them going and found a system, normal service resumes. No fucking pressure what so ever put on wigan, who in fairness battered us in the second half and deserved all 3 points.

The only positive that can be taken is that Kelly once again had a fine game abd is coming along nicely.

651

What was the performance like?

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I think the Lucas argument could have been wrapped up last night. He looked shit.

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Did you watch the game?? The majority of the team were fucking shit. And I blame tactics for most of it. Camping in your own half after going 1-0 up and letting the opposition have the ball is just suicide at any level. There was no pressing/pressurising what so ever. It was miles removed from the first half display against Chelsea which really is a worry as it seems to be his favoured tactic and the Chelsea match was a blip.

Tactics aside there is no excuse for not being able to pass the ball a simple 5 yards. It was shocking last night and Wigan showed what a bit of passion and will to go out and win a game can do. Very lucky to escape with 1 point and Woy blamed the performance on tiredness :rolleyes: tired in November!!

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Another poor result this evening, things not going right. I didnt see the game but read some reports, they had plenty of possession I believe. Lucas sent off :rolleyes: did he deserve it? Its a pity he didnt play well against Stoke, they could well have been interested in him before today.

655

deserved alright. two bookings the second one being a mindless tackles straight after the second goal

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West Ham are a shambles

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Very poor in fairness. Hope he gives one or two young lads a run out in the second half.

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Liverpool have played well in fairness.

Johnson has been very impressive. West Ham fans heading home after 38 mins !!

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Carra out for 3 monthsā€¦ Torres is in bitsā€¦ Utd to come in the cup. :unsure:

660

More quality analysis by Zonal Marking - more so than anything because their piece today agrees with most of the points I made on the EPL thread last night namely the quality dovetailing of Lucas and Meireles and how Hodgson is really bedding down his hard pressing 4-4-2 that protects the back four excellently:

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/12/07/liverpool-3-0-aston-villa/

Ten steps: Liverpoolā€™s win over Aston Villa
December 7, 2010

Liverpool recorded a comfortable 3-0 victory over Gerard Houllierā€™s Aston Villa at Anfield on Monday night.

The scoreline reflects the home sideā€™s dominance ā€“ they were good, Villa were particularly bad. The game looked over after Ryan Babel made it 2-0 on 15 minutes, and Villa offered little threat for the rest of the contest. Houllier switched to 4-4-2 at half-time, as he did in the game against Arsenal when Villa were also 2-0 down at the break, but there was little sign of a fightback.

Roy Hodgson used a 4-4-2 system ā€“ his spine of Jamie Carragher, Steven Gerrard and Fernando Torres were all out. Ryan Babel and David Ngog started upfront, with Maxi Rodriguez keeping his place on the left despite the return of Joe Cole. Sotirios Kyrgiakos started at centre-back alongside Martin Skrtel.

Villa still had a midfield crisis and were also without the suspended Ashley Young, though they welcomed back Marc Albrighton. Stephen Ireland started rather than Robert Pires, and Gabriel Agbonlahor was the lone striker in a 4-4-1-1 / 4-2-3-1 system that saw Albrighton and Stewart Downing switching around throughout.

1. Villa play surprisingly high line
http://img580.imageshack.us/img580/6318/liv1.jpg
Hereā€™s an example from the opening ten minutes of Villaā€™s high line. The ball is in their half of the pitch, yet the defence is only 12 yards from the halfway line, a strange tactic against players of the pace of Ryan Babel and David Ngog. Ngog was flagged offside here, but Babel broke the offside trap for the second goal.

2. Liverpool play higher up the pitch
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/3922/liv2u.jpg
In the first half, Liverpool pressed higher up the pitch than they did at the start of Hodgsonā€™s reign. Rather than retreating immediately to their own third, Liverpoolā€™s midfielders played higher up and put more pressure on the player in possession, breaking up Villaā€™s passing.

3. Ireland very deep
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/2278/liv3.jpg
Partly as a result of this, Stephen Ireland (meant to be the main support to Gabriel Agbonlahor) came very deep looking for the ball. Here, he plays a sideways pass with 10 Liverpool players between him and Pepe Reina.

4. Liverpool wingers narrow
http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/1813/liv5.jpg
Although a lack of width has sometimes hampered Liverpool this season, it worked quite well here. As Aston Villa pushed forward, Liverpoolā€™s two wide midfielders were often in central positions which gave Lucas and Meireles easy forward balls, and contributed to Liverpoolā€™s midfield dominance.

5. Lucas drops back to collect
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/1729/liv4.jpg
Lucas gave Liverpoolā€™s system some flexibility by moving deeper to collect the ball, allowing the centre-backs to spread to the flanks

6. Liverpool able to play out from the back
That was a rare occasion Lucas had to do that, however ā€“ Villa made little attempt to press Liverpool at goal-kicks, and therefore the home side were able to build attacks from deep. Pepe Reina played simple passes out towards his two centre-backs (and sometimes Lucas) and wasnā€™t forced to hit the ball long to the two strikers who didnā€™t fare well in the air.

7. Villa crosses unsuccessful
Without a ā€˜big manā€™ playing upfront and thriving on crosses, Villaā€™s width produced little. Only one of 14 crosses was successful.

8. Agbonlahor struggles
A good lone striker will win aerial challenges and link the play. A decent lone striker will do one or the other well. Agbonlahor was able to do neither (more because of (a) his height and (B) his lack of support, rather than his own failings) and therefore served little purpose.

9. Liverpoolā€™s central midfield duo dovetails well
Of Steven Gerrard, Lucas Leiva and Raul Meireles, Gerrard is clearly the most talented footballer. But is Lucas and Meireles the best of the three potential partnerships? Their understanding was good, they shared defensive and attacking responsibilities, and they ended with near-identical passing records ā€“ though Lucasā€™ assist gives him the edge.

10. Liverpool sit back after half-time
Liverpool played much deeper after the break, soaking up pressure and denying Villaā€™s pacey players space in behind. The chalkboard of Liverpoolā€™s interceptions shows this well - 13 in the second half, 11 inside their own half compared to 8 in the first half, with only 3 inside their own half.