What’s his point there?
There are two simultaneously contradicting narratives among those who seek to defend this constant “Up The Ra” chanting in Irish society.
Narrative 1 is that “it’s just a bit of banter, sure the people singing it weren’t born during the Troubles and they don’t remember it or know of it, it’s not an expression of support for the PIRA”.
Narrative 2 says “the people chanting Up The Ra have a keen awareness of their history”.
These are completely contradictory narratives.
Which is it?
Huh?
Hes right mate. I was hanging out the clothes there and the spaniard across the wall was singing ooh aah up the ra. Im sure of it.
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It’s repetitive, it’s constant, and it’s moronic. It’s in pubs all across Ireland, it’s in every city or town centre on every weekend night. And the people who do it have no interest in a shared society.
It’s the other side of the coin to KAT.
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I’ve never come across it anyway I’d say you’re exaggerating.
Yeah but there are a lot of things you’ve never come across.
Usually sung by the most shit musicians known to man to appeal to the lowest level of society.
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There’s a very good scene in the film Disco Pigs where the two main characters are in this grotty suburban pub where some fella is singing The Men Behind The Wire and then Cillian Murphy’s character gets up on stage on he sings You Really Got Me by The Kinks and the crowd breaks out in a riot because they want Wolfe Tones music. I think the whole scene is meant to portray a contrast between a miserable, insular, ossified, conservative culture and its dislike for anybody “different”.
Weak response.
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Some of the Wolfe Tone stuff I don’t mind, in fact I really like their version of the West Awake.
But the Oh Ah Up the Ra grinds on me.
As does the ‘IRA’, ‘Sinn Féin’ thing in the middle of the Fields of Athenry.
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I like some of the Wolfe Tones’ stuff on a loose level.
It all comes back to the Up The Ra chanting. The song was designed as a sleight of hand to express support for the Provos while pretending not to. When it’s played now and chanted as it is now, it is a clear expression of retrospective justification for civilian slaughter.
Words mean something. The people defending it are trying to pretend that words mean nothing, which is the same rationale used by supporters of Putin, Trump and Brexit.
By the same rationale Loyalists could then justify KAT or singing about Billy Wright as being merely a meme, when we all know it is not merely a meme, it is designed to instil fear in Catholics. Up the Ra is designed to instil fear in the PUL community, as is the Sinn Fein/IRA insertion into The Fields Of Athenry.
This is really basic stuff and it’s depressing people that refuse to get it.
I think those who sing it would say it’s only a it of craic and the beer was in.
Those same people probably refer to people in the six counties as British (that really fucking grinds me) and vow never to vote for Sinn Fein.
That’s those of them with brains, who are not very many.
I went to a born again christian mens rally in the states once. They were all about reclaiming the mans rightful place at the head of the family. Thry had no real logic to anything other than ‘give us your money’ so they resorted to putting clips from films up on the big screen and ‘interpreting’ them for the audience. It worked because soon after some gang types who happened to be there and were definitely real came up from the crowd and promised never to be bold again. They nailed their ‘gang colours’ to a large cross on the stage to prove it. It was amazing.
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I was in kid rocks in Nashville and a band were playing the 11 am slot.
Absolutely sensational stuff. The place was heaving.
Out of nowhere the lead singer stops everything up and brings up a picture of the vaccine on the big screen.
And starts roaring this isn’t freedom I’ll show you freedom and then the screen switched to a picture of the American flag.
Very amusing and the crowd loved it.
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There are all sorts of bizarre fault lines within the broad tent of what you could term “Irish nationalism”.
These self described “patriots” hate Sinn Fein because they think they are “traitors to the white Irish race”, whatever that is. They also love the Catholic Church and want a white Catholic theocracy.
Then you get the people who are still bitter because they believe the Provos sold out (which they actually did, though that was lucky for everybody).
There’s a fault line of hypocrisy where SF’s support (correctly) vilifies the Catholic Church for evils committed under its effective reign of terror - child sex abuse, mother and baby homes, Magdalene laundries etc. Yet they then expect everybody to shut up about the many evils that were committed by the Provos. And you better shut up about paedophiles that were protected by Sinn Fein and the Provos. Don’t bring that up under any circumstances.
That’s ludicrous.
I don’t know how people who identify as “woke” and say let’s listen to victims then suddenly turn around and don’t want to listen to victims.
There’s a fault line of hypocrisy where KAT and “hang Michelle O’Neill” and singing Billy Wright are evil yet let’s celebrate our people who murdered for 28 years.
There’s a fault line of hypocrisy within Irish nationalism where some of them have a residual admiration for Russia because they believe the wrong side won the Cold War, and this leads them to justifying Russia’s barbaric invasion of Ukraine, to supporting the imperial oppressor.
With the Up The Ra chant, the default reaction from Irish nationalists is to go full Trump style troll - “ooohh, that’s wound Joe Duffy up something fierce”, “this is hilarious”. There’s no engagement with the actual substance of what should be a fairly straightforward debate. It’s just fingers in ears and shouting “moooooooooooo”.
There’s a fault line of hypocrisy whereby Irish nationalists believe that the best way to become more Irish is to behave more like the worst of Unionism or the English far right.
And there’s a lot of belief in conspiracies in Sinn Fein’s support, vaccine conspiracies, Covid conspiracies, climate conspiracies etc. Any conspiracy out there really.
I genuinely do believe that in any hypothetical United Ireland referendum, a non-insignificant part of Sinn Fein’s 26 county support would vote against a United Ireland because they’re so far down this pit of negativity about everything, they’d believe it was some sort of conspiracy to make people poorer or less Irish or more British or some such fuckwittery.
No it isn’t. I’d highly doubt any more than say 2% intend it as such. The women’s soccer team didn’t intend it as such.
Of course it is because words have actual meaning. The Ra did Kingsmills and La Mon and Enniskillen and Warrington.
If you shout Up the Ra you’re shouting Up the people who did Kingsmills and La Mon and Enniskillen and Warrington.
That’s exactly what it is.
Same as if somebody in the Shankill sings Up The UVF, they’re shouting Up the people who murdered six people in a pub at Loughinisland.
The exact same.
Can you imagine some War of Independence descendant old fella from Munster agreeing to give up the Tri Colour and Amhrain an BhFiann?
It won’t happen. Compromise is needed but I think staunch ‘Republicans’ would rather leave things as they are.
Yeah I think there are a lot of people who are much more interested in the paraphernalia of Irish nationalism and in self serving conspicuous displays of Irish nationalism than in having an actual 32 county Irish nation based on the principle of respect.
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