They drew the last day and should have clised out without any goals. Why do they “have” to have goals.
Its a very strange view i think. Waterford don’t go for goals full stop, yet they win plenty games.
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Waterford created two or three decent goal chances last weekend.
Ya, more than KK as it happens. In fact they invited KK’s chance
Everything points to a Kilkenny win but I’m not so sure.
Waterford controlled all of the important play last weekend and outdid Kilkenny in the one area that The Cats traditionally dominate - winning 50/50 ball in the air and secondary ball on the ground. Granted, KK were far from their best, but Waterford didn’t allow them to be. It was 6-7 minutes of craven tactics near the end that denied themselves a victory.
They know now that they can do it. Yes. they missed goal chances but on another day could have scored three and it would have been a rout. KK always had a way of winning the fine margins and, in fairness, they managed it when they had to but they were aided hugely by Waterford’s withdrawal in the closing stages.
This KK team, and how they have evolved over the years, are the best I’ve ever seen - no doubt about that. They just strike me as heading into a decline and are ripe for the taking tomorrow evening. It’ll be a battle of experience versus hunger. Hunger might just win out.
Waterford to edge it.
you can beat plenty teams without goals no question. Can you beat KK that often without them? if they got one goal last week it was game over. so of course they CAN win without scoring a goal, but will they? two v different questions.
Cork have done it three times since 99 as it happens, incl 99 final. Has any other side done it?
But that goes for most hurling teams/games. Goals win matches is a pretty accurate hurling piece of mythology. It can often be disproved, but generally the 3 points itself and the moral boost have a big effect.
However scoring goals giving you a vetter chance of winning is no different from KK to Tipp to Junior Hurling. KK don’t just win because they stop goals. Its a very flawed argument to make on behalf of 1 team when its true of every game. Styles matter alot. Waterford don’t spend alot of time looking for goals, but they still win games and nearly won the last day. Thise Cork teams went man to man and won games because they had exceptional defenders.
Its fine margins.
Btw, it is, as i suggested the other day, Jamie Barron and Gleeson who largely were responsible for the waterford team retracting without instruction. De Burca was told go to “D”, but that was it. Even that was probably not needed.
Would could have done without Henry,JJ and Hickey succumbing to age too…[quote=“The_Most_Infamous, post:4910, topic:21107, full:true”]
Was convinced he’d start Larkin…very little threat on that bench for KK otherwise.
They could have done without Richie Power’s knee injuries…
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Cody has quite regularly named dummy teams and made a heap of positional switches from the team named to the actual starting team. Similar to the Kilkenny dont do tactics narrative it never gets much of a mention
My point was Richie Power is still relatively young…and if he did’nt have the bad injuries he’d be a serious addition to that KK panel…he’s still only 30 I think.
Was a brilliant hurler…
Hurling is very much a game of momentum and that is why goals are so important. They can completely shift momentum from one team to another. To hit 5 or 6 points on the spin in a hurling match then you need to be pretty dominant in that spell while two goals could be got out of nothing and the flow and balance of the match is completely changed.
To use the buzzword - goals are game changers
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Ah yeah, know what you mean. What I’m saying is that we are basically fucked and our subs bench is poor.
Waterford by 4
They win games Puke
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I don’t see ye winning the AI on current form, but I can’t see ye losing Saturday either.
There’s also an argument to say that Tipp really haven’t been tested yet…we’ll see what their 3 and 6 are made of on Sunday…know I’m clutching at straws but you have to as a Limerick man.
Ya all of that is true and a goal would have capped and probably assured Waterford display the last day would be a winning one.
Point still stands, Waterford do not have to score a goal to beat KK, they showed us that the last day. They have the fortitude to take the hit of a goal as well and that dramatic 4 point turn around. Thats the story of the game for me in ways and would be the narrative for the week i would suggest. They are mentally strong.
Galway winning would be no surprise, Tipp were good in fairness but i would not read too much into Munster Final.
3 times in 17 years they have been beaten by a side who havent scored a goal. I think thats a fair body of evidence. Your right of course in that it is an obvious point to make, but you seem to be disagreeing with it? you need to put up a big score to beat them because they will normally get one goal minimum, if you dont score a goal you need to convert pretty much all your other chances because they have been masters at limiting those chances over the years. so for e.g. if you are playing Cork you are far more likely to win without scoring goals because Cork are (i) less likely to score one than KK (ii) more likely to give you other scoring chances to build up your points tally.
Waterford scored what, 24 times last week? thats pretty good clipping. And still didnt get over the line.
I think we are all agreed they dont HAVE to score a goal to win. But they are FAR FAR more likely to win if they do score a goal.
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Hasn’t Cody’s teams only only been beaten something like 5 times in total?
1999, 2001, 2004 x 2, 2005, 2010, 2013 x 2. 8 times.
Ya but they showed they can do it. No reason whatsoever to say they cannot again. In fact its more likely they don’t give Hogan as much soace to tap over his points.
Both teams were very accurate for most of the last day. So KK had to be amazingky good with what they got to stay in touch.
I do disagree that you have to score goals to beat KK. And you already gave the stats to show it.
How many games have KK won in that oeriod without goals?
Yep. Unreal record. Think thats a lot of my point. They dont concede goals so they dont lose that often.