Budget 2012

There’s plenty of jobs in abattoirs and places like that but the lazy Irish won’t work. Bomb the lot of them.

The Dutch have the right idea with their Scumtowns.

Can someone please explain exactly how the property tax will work or is calculated?
I’m reading conflicting reports. I saw mentions of “bands” in one place, but in another it’s just .18% of the market value up to €1m euro an 0.25% after that

Yeah. Great outlook. Sell it to the 14% on the live register. And factor in the former self employed who get nothing and the hundreds of thousands of emigrants and the complete lack of any change in jobs prospects in Ireland in the next few years while you’re at it.

It is 5% of what you paid you paid for the house every year-harsh but fair I think.

What you said there after is what it is, and it’s fixed for 3 years I believe. How they are going to verify “market value” I don’t know.

I understand that Flano is going to do it.

More “jobs for the boys” eh? Typical.

Unless you’ve stood toe to toe with a rabbit, I dont think you can make fun of Flano.

They mentioned on the news that residents associations might come together and decide on the market value for their estate and they then all submit similar values.

Ah he’s a harmless jackeen Paulie mate.

I think Julio’s philosophy is that the poor will work harder if you give them less money, but the rich will work harder if you give them more money.

Strange also how the people who are crying out for the dole to be cut are usually the same people crying out for the minimum wage to also be cut. Presumably the hope then is that as there will be no incentive to stay on the dole but also no incentive to work, that enough poor people will then decide to fuck off and die, or at least emigrate to Australia and never come back, therefore reducing public spending and solving the problem.

It’s extremely important that in order to save the Irish economy, that it is destroyed first. We must not waver in this endeavour.

You lack of grasp of economics is glaring at this point Sid. You seem to think that cutting unemployment & cutting minimum wage levels are contradictary view points to have?

The main cause of unemployment is that companies can’t afford to employ people due to their unrealistic wage demands fuelled by the high levels of unemployment benefit and the minimum wage floor. Removing or at least lowering both makes employing people more affordable.

Remove the minimum wage and halve welfare, people will work when its worth their while to do so and not until it is. Companies will be able to afford employing staff again. The burden on the state is reduced and when conditions return to normality wages will increase naturally as supply falls.

me and all…but that shouldn’t mean we can’t empathise with TFK ‘most vulnerable’

???

:popcorn:

As in the market will set a fair price to pay people, otherwise they won’t work

Ah the market The good old market that was going to look after everything in the noughties. The market will look after this and the market will look after that. The market looked after fuck all only itself and it transpired that the market was only a few bluffers in pin stripe suits who hadn’t a fucking clue what they were doing. Fuck off with your market.

Spot on Fagan.

JG, you appear to be a fully signed up to an economic philosophy (washington consensus style) that has brought us a global economic crisis and has been proved not to provide the benefits it promised. Have you not realised that the economic theory you seem to consider fact is rather opinion, opinion that became orthodoxy for a long time but that has largely been proved to be wrong?

If you reduce dole and minimum wage at the same time you still have that “poverty trap” that is such a beloved concept of people like yourself (although I don’t subscribe to that theory and ESRI studies have shown it to be rubbish anyway).

If you halve dole like you want, people will literally starve. The notion that “the market” will create anywhere near enough jobs to take up the slack if you lower the minimum wage is, frankly, fantasy. Modern management ideology doesn’t think like that. Modern management ideology is about being able to get by cutting as much as possible.

What we have and what you want to accelerate is a situation where each individual business has to cut its own cloth to match - ie redundancies - think of it like a household. That’s fine for each individual household (business). Unfortunately the economy as a whole cannot be run like a household. When the economy cuts so much, every individual business is forced to cut a little more, that means less jobs, the economy as a whole suffers.

The likelihood is that more and more businesses will close because aggregate spending and aggregate demand plummets. So you have pretty much the same unemployment rate as before (the likeihood is that any increase in employment due to a lower minimum wage will be cancelled out by more lay-offs and businesses closing) but a lot more people not being able to even able to afford a roof over their heads. Mortgage default rates increase. The banks get into even deeper trouble which means more taxpayers’ money to bail them out. Plus GDP/GNP goes substantially down. Therefore the state’s debt to GDP/GNP ratio goes up exponentially.

Fine Gael’s policies actually look extremely sensible compared to what you want brought in.

Someone must have bought Julio a suit.