Coronavirus - Here come the variants

But itā€™s an undeniable truth that cases were rising very sharply in the pre-Christmas period.

Was that not scary?

Of course there are agendas involved. ISAG have an agenda. Gript have an agenda. Business lobby groups have an agenda. Doctors working on the front line who are interviewed have an agenda. NPHET have an agenda. The Government in their own way have an agenda. Posters here have an agenda. Everybody has an agenda.

Good faith debate will, or should, thrash out whose agendas are worth listening to most closely and whose should be listened to less.

Well obviously I disagree about the debate, but if youā€™ve found it to be worthy then who am I to disagree, itā€™s been very one sided.

I believe myself to be firmly in the middle, I see valid arguments for both sides, just because Iā€™m not entrenched in the OIUTF at all costs donā€™t take it that Iā€™m gone the other way

I know that you see the difference. Itā€™s not good enough that you think it coincided with the truth.

Iā€™ve posted an article from behavioural psychologist advising NPHET criticising them for relying on fear to engender compliance. I agree with her. I think itā€™s a good critique. This is one of the areas I think we could have managed a lot better by the way.

Hereā€™s another article that builds on the earlier one criticising the fear based approach to messaging, thereā€™s an article or you can listen to her talking to Matt Cooper at about 49 mins.

Edit: I donā€™t read gript as Iā€™m sure you know. The example I gave didnā€™t come from gript.

Thereā€™s a reporter from southern California who has been writing for the past year and really struggling to try and understand how SoCal did so well and then got overwhelmed in the fall/winter wave. She spoke to the head of the Immunology department at UCSD (San Diego) and asked him what in his opinion drove it. He simple answered ā€œI donā€™t knowā€. Probably the most honest answer we have had from an expert.

Fair enough pal, thereā€™s more to debate though than just lockdowns,

I think the vaccines have been debated fairly well on here as well and I certainly would not be in the majority with regards to my viewpoint on them.

We donā€™t. We have better health infrastructure than most of Europe anyway. Especially when you mobilise the private as well, which we did.

I think there is a very large degree of fear of being seen to be wrong involved at all levels, and especially in the current media environment.

Natural cautiousness, disbelief, incomprehension at the scale of the challenge and the measures that would be needed. All that contributed to the slow response.

When I was posting here before I myself went through a period of cognitive dissonance about what was happening. Fear translated into gallows humour, but that was mixed with a sort of tired ā€œseen it all beforeā€ type mindset going back to previous pandemics. I think the penny started dropping for real around the last eight or nine days of February 2020 that this really was deadly serious.

Fair play to you, you saw the threat early. I disagree with a lot of your posting since the pandemic began but you were definitely off the mark early.

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I think some of your views are mad but you never seem to get riled up or aggressive in any of your debating with people, fair to play to you.

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But sometimes I think there has to be fear, sometimes the gravity of a situation is such that there is no alternative. What I do think is counterproductive is preaching at ordinary people for venial sins as regards breaches of restrictions. If you think Iā€™m extreme, I have a brother who is way more extreme in this regard, despite being at best partially informed, and his attitude is not persuasive to say the least.

One of the unmentionable doctors made what I thought was a great call back in December. She looked at the rates rising suddenly, with an identical trajectory across all london boroughs. While all around here list their heads she said it was bollox and that the most likely explanation was cross contamination in a test centre. ā€¦she was right of course

I donā€™t think youā€™re extreme. I still think youā€™re purposely missing the point, Iā€™ve drawn the distinction for you already, not that you needed me to, and Iā€™ll leave it at that. I do have an extremely negative view of the ISAG. I do agree on your second point, itā€™s what the people in the articles I posted links to were talking about.

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She reports people from standing outside a church socially distance yet goes to BLM protest. The definition of a WOKE politician who is all for free speech until it doesnā€™t suit her narrative.

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I donā€™t think sheā€™s a headbanger but she does appear to be an asshole. Itā€™s an important distinction.

Donā€™t know anything about herā€¦ But McGuirk has an odious track record that is being ignored because you agree with him. Youā€™re a clever lad, Iā€™m sure you can see the point

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I know Iā€™m repeating myself but this girl gets far too much of the spotlight on TFK, sheā€™s just a harmless local councillor, she stands for a lot of what is good in Limerick city also, we donā€™t really need to drag her into this horseshit every day, she gets a difficult enough time of it online without us adding our voice to it

That wonā€™t be popular but itā€™s needless

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I think part of the issue is that ISAG have continually tried to portray themselves as not having a political agenda - of being a group of scientists presenting ā€œfactsā€.

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I didnā€™t know she posted here

Can you post up that article?

Are you a medical scientist? Where did you study medicine? I only listen to doctors?

The same folk that complain that they should have got a second opinion when they find.out they are fucked for believing their GP.

Because our goals and objectives havenā€™t changed. LIDTF, nphet and the gubberment have consistently move the goalposts, denied science and blundered along for 13 months. Scandal after scandal left untouched mainly yet the common man (& women & whatever you identify as) is left to blame and suffer.