He only went there this year
It’s no surprise Galway made real progress this year. Down, Derry and Tyrone all made great progress in Tally’s tenure.
In Down and Derry’s case, they fell away alarmingly when Tally left their backroom teams.
If Down were to appoint someone with intercounty management experience the criticism would be its someone who previously failed, someone who was successful years ago and the game has changed massively since, or someone with recent success which was all down to the coach he had with him.
I’m well aware Tally was only with Galway 1 year and he was someone that squad needed to experience but it’s also now time for them to move in a different direction that this year’s management team were unlikely to be able to take them.
I have no ide why you would think that.
Galway have had their most successful season in 17 years.
People can talk about open football all they want, but Galway are somewhat limited. They only have Walsh and Comer really who would hurt you. Their backs and midfield is athletic and found a system but it’s not really full of class either.
Maybe he left them with enough to move the needle themselves but what I find happens in cases like this (Fitzmaurice and Kerry after CON left and plenty personal experience) is the head coach/manager reverts a bit to type and throws in some of the stuff he did not like being taken away by other coach previously, no matter how successful. Now I do not know what Walsh is like personality wise but there is a massive chance that may happen.
1 Like
As for Tally. By all means have him as the Head Coach. But he needs a manager. The title doean’t matter, but look at Carlow. Poacher doesn’t have any of the nonsense the deal with and TOB is and dab hand at it and very likable. That’s the kind of man Down need here.
It will take from his talents if this is the role in the traditional sense. Absolutely certain of that
Positivity within the county is usually a vital ingredient for a team to progress, and despite their relative success Galways footballers were not fully backed by supporters this year due to the style of play. Galway have a couple of footballing defenders returning next year and have Walsh, Comer, Burke and Daly up front. Them 4 have plenty to prove but there are very few counties with 4 better. Unless they feel like they have the full backing of supporters it’s hard to get lads to fully commit, and they won’t get that support unless they play positive football. Defensive football will be supported for a while in counties with no history of success or counties where a siege mentality suits the psyche, Galway don’t fit either description. That’s why there was even talk last week from some closely involved that it may be time for Walsh to go - Tally going instead now allows Walsh to get a coach with a different focus to bring a fresh approach.
As for Tally, no seriously ambitious coach will settle for not getting a go at the top job. He will want to identify the players within Down he wants in his squad and the support staff he needs to deliver success. Yes it’s a different role to coaching but just because he is a top coach doesn’t mean he can’t be a top manager as he has proven at Sigerson level.
Plenty coaches have no interest in being top man.
A whole tribe of them around the country
1 Like
To be viewed with the same suspicion as assistant managers who don’t want to manage.
No just have no interest in the bullshit
So the requirement to deal with the bullshit prevents them from seeking a role they may otherwise desire? That surely indicates they are not seriously ambitious.
You just don’t get it fella
One can just enjoy coaching you know.
Why do they have to be “ambitious”?
Of course, but my original point was no seriously ambitious coach like Tally will settle for not getting a go at the top job. In my experience many coaches involved at that level who are happy just to coach are bluffers afraid of being exposed so like to hide behind others and blame any under performance on the manager not listening to them.
The exact opposite in alot of cases.
They love coaching and hate the bullshit attached with management
Im waiting for training to start here for a county development squad as it happens so i have some time. Il make a few statements and you can just reply agreeing or disagreeing:
A top coach will want to provide the environment for his group to achieve their maximum
An inadequate manager ensures a group won’t achieve their maximum
Partnerships where a coach and manager agree on all aspects are incredibly rare
[quote=“Halfpipe, post:4624, topic:5676”]
A top coach will want to provide the environment for his group to achieve their maximum - Absolutely. That’s exactly it. As soon as it becomes about the manager or coach everyone is fucked!!!
An inadequate manager ensures a group won’t achieve their maximum - Think the Trappatoni quote is suitable here “a good manager can maybe make 5% increase in performance, but a bad one can decrease 30%”. Truth is its incredibly rare to get 15-30 people to their maximum at the same time. In everything above moderate club level in Ireland (let’s include serious clubs as well as IC) the managers job is more about managing the management team than the players.
Partnerships where a coach and manager agree on all aspects are incredibly rare - ya, but so what? It’s mutual respect. Manager makes final call on anything. They should not work together if they are miles apart on things. So that’s a hiring issue. But once people know their roles it’s fine.
I’m in 2 roles right now, polar opposites. 1 manager gave me what he wanted for the team. I designed training around that. I do not agree with everything but he has agree long term vision and it’s very hard for a anyone to truly get inside ones mind. We are being spectacularly successful compared to the past. We get on famously but I know not to push too hard against it. He has coached a fair bit. But we share very similar views on game. He is kinda learning management. Its just for this bunch he has a different vision. However he has been looking at some of these players for years as its his club. So thats why i am very haply to be guided. I personally think I could coach any team in ireland, however I any a few years away from management in same bracket, and may never reach or want that. Who knows. 10 years could tell a different story. I am a hybrid coach (skills, team play & S&C), there is enough in that to try and master for a long while yet.
The other I have total freedom. The only directive was make everyone better. This guy’s skills land in man management. He is superb at it. I’d say he couldn’t coach a hand passing drill. But that’s irrelevant.
Both jobs are hugely rewarding. But very different.
3 Likes
Looks like Aidan O’Shea has appointed his Breaffy backroom team to assist him with the Mayo job next year.
1 Like
So to summarise of the 2 coaching roles you mention you are coaching 1 group in a way you don’t believe in and began coaching another in a way you do believe in but had no idea if it would be useful to the group in game situations because you had no clear directive from the manager on game situations. I don’t know but if I had to guess I’d say you are getting paid for both roles or trying to get coaching experience. I see this with a lot of teams at a high level with muddled thinking and mixed messages throughout leading to players not fully buying in and listless performances. Players very quickly realise that there is a lack of belief in the message they are receiving and then begin to have doubts or tune out, especially those at a high level who have good game intelligence.
Coaches like Tally, who coach both skills and game plans, inevitably will want to pick the players to best implement their plan. To devise and coach a gameplan effectively they also need excellent management skills. Where they can often fall down is in adaptability and this is why choosing carefully when selecting other members of the management team is so important.
Ypu have no idea what ypu are talking about.
Team 1, share largely same idea with manager on how game should be played. We agree on most things. Not all. That’s all. That was the context and parameter of your question.
2nd team I was brought in on recommendation, so based on my experience and skills the manager just let me at it. Not sure why you think “improve everyone individually” is not a directive. They are just a team at the start of the curve. It makes sense.
As for the rest, had little to do with the questions you asked me.
My bottom line and point is, coaching and management are different beasts. They take on dual status in club scene alot because of volunteering. But it’s actually very rare someone can carry both our at a high level. What tends to happen is good coaches evolve into managers. But only after years and years of experience.
However some people can be good managers without ever having coached to after great degree
1 Like
Left-field name throw for the Waterford hurling manager’s job: Caroline Currid.