GAA Managerial Merrygoround Thread

He had reasonably good players with Offaly though, the Malones, Vinnie Claffey, Finbar Cullen, Ciaran McManus, Cathal Daly. I suppose they weren’t anywhere before he took them over though.

He embarassed himself with Dublin in the end. His refusal announce his team until a couple of minutes before throw in could be understood maybe, but then giving players numbers which were completely incorrect given their position seemed to confuse even his own players.

He seemed to have completely lost it by the end.

I think that’s being harsh on them. They lived with Tipp for most of that game and Tipp were outstanding that day. I thought they lacked enough individual quality this year and that’s what cost them in the end.

As for Munster, I think Tipp got a lot out of it over the last two years. It made them the team they are this year. For a team that’s already won an All Ireland? Hard to know. Maybe it doesn’t matter. I still don’t think teams set themselves out for championship with any other intention than playing their best though. I think the media and the supporters come up with all the theories afterwards about teams not trying their best and the rest of it. For the management and the players the games are still massive. It’s the people on the outside who’ve really changed.

Teams don’t go out to lose wtb, but they tailor their training to the business end of the year. All training is done now on a periodical basis. Even at club level teams are not putting in the effort for 1st rounds down here in Cork, i know its the same in Dublin. The amount of teams that have lost their 1st and/or 2nd round’s and gone on to win the County is remarkable. I know our whole year is being tailored next year to peak far later.

No provincial winners in All-ireland football semi finals, very poor standard in the “famed” Munster hurling championship.

I don’t think Waterford were ever in with a chance in that game, Tipp had them at arms length all the way through. Tipp were training extremely heavily in the lead up to the Cork game, i believe even up to a week before hand. Thats shows you what they were thinking. Fine, we might beat Cork, but its not the end of the world either. I think what surprised them was how poor they were and how good Cork were.

Conor Counihan admitted that he had planned for the qualifiers all year. Cork clearly didn’t want to lose to Kerry, but were planning for it.

So, its not a media and supporters changing alone, the players and management have as well. This years results and comments afterwards prove that.

James Horan will be confirmed as new Mayo manager later tonight.

New Mayo manager James Horan names James Nallen, Tom Prendergast and Martin Connolly as selector.

Mayo dodged a bullet there with tommy lyons

Anyone read the following in the tribune yesterday?

Why Davy ignored interval stat attack on Tipp is a fact that doesn’t figure

Waterford’s dedicated statistics team volunteered at great expense to the cause but they were overlooked at the vital hour, writes Enda McEvoy

The sick man of Munster hurling appointing a new manager to general acclaim. The reigning provincial champions reappointing the incumbent boss to less than general acclaim. Ordinarily the first Sunday of October is far too early a juncture to be talking about next year’s Munster championship. Not this first Sunday of October.

With the appointment of Donal O’Grady, Limerick’s wounds have been cauterised, at least for the next year or two. Thus the county’s annus horribilis, one that saw them relegated from the top flight after losing most of their panel, finishes on an upbeat note. Things will get better for Limerick, if only because they cannot get worse. With Davy Fitz handed a one-year extension, an uneasy peace was maintained in Waterford. Thus a season that saw them win a slightly improbable Munster title finishes with the Clareman still in situ but with no shortage of detractors dotted throughout the long grass. The long-range forecast suggests storms.

Consider the contribution of the Dungarvan delegate at last Monday’s county board meeting that rubber-stamped Fitzgerald’s reappointment. “We’ve lost the ability to turn out skilful teams,” he lamented. “Whereas Waterford teams were once loved and respected all over the country for the quality of their play, the standards have come down dramatically in the last few years. When we came up against the counties that really mattered we failed.”

Consider the reference by another delegate to supposed “problems” between “some players” and the manager. Consider the pointed enquiry from Tony Mansfield about the size of Fitzgerald’s backroom team. Consider the pledge given by the county board that any future expensive weekends away for the panel would have to be agreed to in advance by the executive. Consider the Munster Express poll that indicated support from 57 per cent of the Waterford public for another year of the Clareman. Now opinion polls can and should be taken with a grain of salt, as Enda Kenny is no doubt telling everyone at the moment, but as a gauge of the mood on the ground on Suirside it’s instructive.

Here’s another subject for contemplation while we’re at it. Consider the views of Fitzgerald’s unpaid stats team, who say the feedback they provided to him and his selectors during matches, from the National League opener against Dublin onwards, put Waterford “way ahead of all other counties in terms of the ability of the management to assess each player’s performance in real time.” Yet on the day of the All Ireland semi-final went ignored. In fact, when presented with the half-time printout, the manager “put it in his back pocket and never looked at it”, they claim.

The stats team was headed by Kenneth Cullinane, an ordinary Waterford supporter from a farming background in Ross, Carrick-On-Suir, who works in transport. Following a meeting with Davy Fitz in September 2009, he and his brother Bernard were asked to provide both statistical and video analysis for the Waterford management this year. The brothers thereupon assembled a team of 12 people to provide live statistics during the course of games and commissioned a computer programmer to write a software package to analyse and compile these statistics on the spot. At each game they had eight people monitoring the Waterford players, with each person concentrating on two particular players and the eighth concentrating on the goalkeeper. Each monitor had a hand-held device that recorded every piece of action involving the players he was monitoring.

The information was instantly relayed to a central laptop computer held by Bernard Cullinane in either the team dug-out or the stand. This meant that each player’s performance could be seen on the screen live, with an instant accurate assessment available to the management. The information was then relayed to Fitzgerald via Pat Bennett, one of his selectors. A printout of each player’s performance was also provided to the team management at half-time and full-time. The system was trialled during the Waterford Crystal tournament at the start of the year and, according to the Cullinanes, “worked perfectly” all the way through to the All Ireland semi-final against Tipperary.

In addition, the brothers put together a separate group of four hurling experts to provide video analysis. On the basis of this analysis they compiled an individual DVD of each player’s performance, to be handed to the players on the Tuesday night after each game. Overall an enormous amount of work went into the initiative, all of which was done voluntarily. The running costs came to a total of €16,500, all of it borne by the Cullinanes’ team apart from a contribution of €3,000 from Club Déise towards the cost of providing the live game statistics. This, asserts Kenneth Cullinane, “reflects the depth of commitment to the cause of Waterford hurling on the part of the entire statistics team.”

So what went wrong against Tipperary? Firstly, Cullinane says, the team put “exactly the same effort” into the semi-final as they did for previous matches. "Secondly, against Tipperary our live statistics identified key problem areas with certain players at a very early stage of the game. However, on this occasion the normal system of relaying this information was dispensed with by Davy Fitzgerald and his selectors. Furthermore, when presented with the half-time printout, Davy put it in his back pocket and never looked at it.

“The key point here is that the statistics clearly identified the problems [the corner-forward playing way too deep and nobody covering the space in front of Brick Walsh, meaning Noel McGrath had the freedom of the park] and without the manager looking at them he either could not see where things were going wrong himself or if he could, he failed to act on them. I should add that Davy also chose not to use video analysis of Tipperary in the run-up to the game, as was done to great effect prior to the Munster final against Cork. It was very disappointing that an effective system which had been put together at great cost in terms of time, effort and money and which had been successful throughout the year was abandoned by Davy when the need was greatest for Waterford, its players and huge band of loyal supporters. This course of action, we believe, proved fatal to our chances of beating Tipperary who are now, of course, the new All Ireland champions.”

That’s what the Cullinanes have to say. They’d have said it before this but their local paper wouldn’t print their letter. There’ll be more to come about Waterford in the next few weeks when Dan Shanahan’s autobiography and Damien Tiernan’s account of the county’s fortunes under Justin McCarthy and Fitzgerald hit the shelves.

Further storms are forecast for the month of October.

emcevoy@tribune.ie

October 3, 2010

Waterford are becoming something of a laughing stock with this carry on. Everyone in the county seems to be running to the papers with stories and now there are a couple of books on the way that promise to ‘dish more dirt’. They are going to destroy themselves with this shite which I suppose is good news for the rest of us. The above article reflects badly on McEvoy but even worse on the clown that is quoted. Presumably he’s trying to advertise his system as well as voice his concerns, because that’s certainly what the article reads like. The irony of course is that not a single manager of any note will dream of touching some gobshite who runs to the national papers when a manager hasn’t taken his advice.

Regardless of individual incidents like this one there’s general disillusion in Waterford with Davy Fitz to the extent that you wonder what he is doing getting involved with them again? Two senior players (at least) publicly criticising him this year plus Paul Flynn who bar an isolated period around the Munster final hasn’t stopped complaining about him. There’s a sense that some people are unhappy that they’ve stopped playing champagne hurling and that others believe that tactics was what cost them against Tipperary. On top of that every crackpot in the county is being provided airtime to explain their own personal opinion as to why Davy is destroying them. The upcoming books are only going to make all this worse. I’ve a feeling we could be watching Waterford in meltdown.

'Davy put it in his back pocket and never looked at it. ’ Ffs :rolleyes:

Agree with WTB here. Waterford in danger of making a holy show of themselves with this shite. The recriminations have already began and I can’t see Davy’s reign there ending in anything other than acrimony when it does end. He’d have been better off walking after the semi but then again Davy’s a total loop the loop himself, he’ll probably love every minute of what looks like being a long, protracted and bitter fall-out.

Waterford people are crazy, no doubt about it. But that was retarded from Davy if true.

He’s only a bluffer.

In an effort to utilise all the leftover bainisteoir gear from Banty’s time in charge, Eamon McEneaney has been appointed the new Monaghan manager.

Joe Dooley is staying in charge in Offaly. Francis Forde is to be brought in as coach. Anyone know much about him?

Liam Sheedy has quit as Tipp manager

I see, just like Nicky before him, Sheedy has jumped ship from Tipp. Edit, fuck dancing baby :stuck_out_tongue:

Tomas O Flaherta (sp) to be the new Galway manager?

Move evidence that Davy is a bluffer…and Waterford hurlers are a shower of babies…

[size=“6”]McCarthy lashes out at former Waterford charges[/size]
By Michael Moynihan
Thursday, October 14, 2010
JUSTIN MCCARTHY has broken his silence on his departure as Waterford hurling manager, describing the players as “bluffers” who did not give him credit, stating it wasn’t a “f**king creche” he was running when manager in the southeast.

In a new book on Waterford hurling by RTÉ’s Damien Tiernan, ‘The Ecstasy and the Agony: The Real Story Behind Waterford Hurling’, McCarthy says his departure in 2008 was down to a lack of respect, adding that he had gone to Waterford “to help out” and that players did not give him credit for their success.

“I like the underdog and I was only going there to help out,” said McCarthy. “Players sometimes lean on the manager too much, fearing that if you leave the dressing room, their world will collapse. They have to grow up and realise they’re men.”

McCarthy added that Waterford players were “irrational” off the field.

"Some players didn’t want to give me credit for what we achieved; then they held grudges and I was left to deal with a lot of egos and personalities — a lot of bluffers.

"We had leaders on the field but a lot of irrational players off the field.

"And sometimes they blamed everyone but themselves. I won manager of the month twice and I never heard a player say ‘Well done’.

"They wouldn’t because it would give me too much credit.

"I was popular in Waterford because I respected people and I made the fans happy with the success. I never ignored a fella or the backroom staff.

"People got jealous and love to have you knocked. A friend of mine said he didn’t know how I stuck it for six months never mind six years.

"I enjoyed my time in Waterford and I never doubted the players’ enthusiasm but I don’t think they enjoyed it as much as me.

"You will always get fellas who will chance their arm, but people have to learn to grow up and do things for themselves — you can’t pamper people or they’ll go soft. Players had to grow up and learn for themselves and many didn’t.

“When people get spoiled and soft, it’s too easy to blame the teacher or the boss. It wasn’t a f**king creche we were running in Waterford.”

McCarthy describes himself as “strong mentally and spiritually” in the book.

"I travelled to Waterford night after night and I never had a lad say to me, ‘Jaysus Justin, you must be tired after all the driving’.

"I didn’t make any money with Waterford and lost valuable money in wear and tear on the car over the years.

“But Waterford won’t make or break me. I just love the game and I’m strong mentally and physically. We brought in some people to the setup but I didn’t break the bank or put pressure on the county board finances.”

The book also recounts current manager Davy Fitzgerald’s preparation of the Waterford side for the 2008 All-Ireland final against Kilkenny, which included putting black and amber jerseys on tackle bags which Waterford players punched.

Fitzgerald also gathered the Déise panel in a circle where he threw two Kilkenny jerseys on the ground, telling his players that their opponents had no respect for them. The book also outlines Fitzgerald’s instructions to certain players ahead of that final to “soften up” their opponents.

“Some lads straight away didn’t like what he said,” one player is quoted as saying.

“Eoin Murphy was one of the quieter chaps and the Prenders (Prendergasts) were the same way; it wouldn’t be in them; they wouldn’t be that type of hurler; and I’d say it definitely played on their minds.”

:smiley: :smiley: :smiley:

Thats up there with the speech he had recorded on Youtube when he was with that college in Limerick where he fooked out every second word.

Idiotic stuff, he is an awful tard. Those days are long gone.

Yep, if you have to engage in that sort of crap to get lads motivated for Waterfords first All Ireland final in half a century it shows how limited a coach he must be.

Shows you how weak he thought they were, rightly or wrongly.

I am hearing that Conor Counihan will announce tomorrow evening that he will stay on as Cork manager for a further two years.