Send Frank a box of exploding cigars
[quote=“myboyblue”]Yet no effort has been made to oust this man in all this time? No concerted effort can be taken, what with all the Clubs down there, to oust this man?
I find it astonishing that he can be left in there, in a democratic organisation.[/quote]
Its a legal issue from what i believe.
[quote=“caoimhaoin”]I never thought the GAA needed Cork doing this, but ye are suggesting that everything myself and others have outlined is normal?!
I don’t believe that for a second, and while every county has its problems, we have had a full time County Secretary for 30 years, thats what the problem is. Its an amateur association, and in most other roles in the county board everyone has to move on after 3 years. I see the need for a full time secretary, but i believe he should be only an advisor to the executive.
Things have slightly improved in Cork with the leagues, but the championships are still all over the place.
I’ll give an example of Franks meddaling recently, could be longwinded, but it will give ye an idea. Say we are club A, there is a club B (Franks club in football) and club C. Club A finishes top of the league, having fullfilled all 12 games within the set out dates. Its a top 4 play-off after that. Team B is 3 points behind team C with 2 games left. Team C recieves 2 walkovers from clubs out of the running. Team B have one game called off because the opposition’s field was unplayable on the last weekend of the fixtures. The club who’s pitch was unplayable gave a walkover to team B. They lost their other game. The CCB (Frank) refuse to accept the walkover, and rule that neither team gets the points. This wasn’t sorted at a meeting, it was sorted out over the phone, no discussion! Team C got through to the semi final against ourselves.
The reason its imprtant is that there is relatively big money for the winners. Then the same Team C got our league semi final put off for 6 weeks (eventually played in December), all relating to their Minors having a run in the County Championahip. Absolutely ludicious. When the game was played (on a weekend when we had requested it not to be due to a players wedding) they used 1 Minor!? What the fuck, we expected half the team there such was the fuss about it. The words burnout were used, unbelievable. Anyway we beat them minus 10 of our starting team, and believe me we celebrated like it was championship due to this bullshit.
The secretary kept 30+ adult players waiting to finish their season because his club wanted to play one Minor in a fucking league semi final.
We are still awaiting the final, and i believe its being penciled in for March. The last time this happened we never got the medals, and had to hound them for the clubs money.
Thats just one small thing that happens all the fucking time.[/quote]
Sounds pretty much like what happens in Wexford (and I’m sure other counties) to me anyway. Loads of championship games postponed, some due to a lad being on the extended panel of the county minor team or something shite like that.
Our secretary is full time too-probably a job for life if she wants it.
Honestly, Kev, it does sound like you think only Cork are the worst off.
[quote=“myboyblue”]Yet no effort has been made to oust this man in all this time? No concerted effort can be taken, what with all the Clubs down there, to oust this man?
I find it astonishing that he can be left in there, in a democratic organisation.[/quote]
Efforts have been made, don’t worry about that.
but things like that do happen kev, and thats the thing, its up to clubs and officers to sort it out, not for players to strike.
in wexford this year, the underage fixtures committee resigned enmasse because of interfering from the adult co.board chairman. a team was thrown out of the championship, and he reinstated them, even though he had no right to do so. So the committee expressed their grievances and stated that they can not work under conditions like that,and it went to voting and debate within the county meetings.
fixtures in every county are a disaster. Wexford had no representative in this years football club AI series because the county final was on the day before the first round, and it was even postponed a week to try accomodate the winners, but they said they wouldnt play the day after. its up to clubs to correct this, not players striking. There is 2 distinct set up in clubs, administrative, and playing. Players have to know that their clubs and delegates are handling their affairs properly. They shouldnt be concerning themselves with what the secretary is doing.
[quote=“Pikeman”]Sounds pretty much like what happens in Wexford (and I’m sure other counties) to me anyway. Loads of championship games postponed, some due to a lad being on the extended panel of the county minor team or something shite like that.
Our secretary is full time too-probably a job for life if she wants it.
Honestly, Kev, it does sound like you think only Cork are the worst off.[/quote]
What i outlined there is more about bias really. I understand everyone has problems with fixtures, thats not the point. The point is that people get fucked around, if they complain or make an issue they get fucked around even more. I have investigated this to a point where last year myself and other nearly set up a Club Players association, with the main priority of getting a master fixtures list. I know from the fixtures point of view Waterford for one is every bit as bad as Cork. I also got similar stories from a number of other counties. Work, playing and coaching commitments meant i simply couldn’t really get into it.
The GAA are also putting pressure on counties to sort it out, we’ll see how it goes.
I think we are loosing sight of what the players are trying to do here. While Frank is one of the main problems, i don’t think fixtures etc is their main priority. So i don’t think you can be saying the players shouldn’t be sorting this out. Ye are absolutely right, its up to the clubs to sort it out.
Thats what I’ve been trying to say. The players should be doing this through their clubs. They should have got their clubs to put forward motions relating to the removal of Frank Murphy. If the motions were ruled out of order for some scurrilous reason then let the clubs call on the players to withdraw their services from the county board. If Frank Murphy is as bad as you say he is then I’m sure there would have been no shortage of support from other clubs.
If change was needed then it had to be the clubs that were seen to be driving it, not a group of players who were already very unpopular in many quarters.
[quote=“The Runt”]Thats what I’ve been trying to say. The players should be doing this through their clubs. They should have got their clubs to put forward motions relating to the removal of Frank Murphy. If the motions were ruled out of order for some scurrilous reason then let the clubs call on the players to withdraw their services from the county board. If Frank Murphy is as bad as you say he is then I’m sure there would have been no shortage of support from other clubs.
If change was needed then it had to be the clubs that were seen to be driving it, not a group of players who were already very unpopular in many quarters.[/quote]
Again i will say its an Employment law issue, everyone involved in any sort of coup would be open to being dragged through the courts. I know of people who looked into it, and i have had some experience on Employment Law, he would have everyones arses in the bacon slicer big time.
[quote=“The Runt”]Thats what I’ve been trying to say. The players should be doing this through their clubs. They should have got their clubs to put forward motions relating to the removal of Frank Murphy. If the motions were ruled out of order for some scurrilous reason then let the clubs call on the players to withdraw their services from the county board. If Frank Murphy is as bad as you say he is then I’m sure there would have been no shortage of support from other clubs.
If change was needed then it had to be the clubs that were seen to be driving it, not a group of players who were already very unpopular in many quarters.[/quote]
All assuming that then 2008 players led by donal have anyone bar themselves at heart. This is about power and personalities.
I would guess that deep down if they got rid of frank, and now gerald, then little things like fixtures and motions would be left behind fairly quickly.
Shameful if thats the case then Kev, that he was allowed put himself into this sort of power in teh first place. Everyone in Cork GAA should hang their head over this.
Interesting how it never bothered them over the past 20 odd years though.
[quote=“caoimhaoin”]I have investigated this to a point where last year myself and other nearly set up a Club Players association, with the main priority of getting a master fixtures list. I know from the fixtures point of view Waterford for one is every bit as bad as Cork. I also got similar stories from a number of other counties. Work, playing and coaching commitments meant i simply couldn’t really get into it.
The GAA are also putting pressure on counties to sort it out, we’ll see how it goes.[/quote]
A master fixtures list was sought in Wexford too manys a time. Always pretty much shot down.
Croke Park set up some committee to look at club fixtures set up in each county to try sort all of this.
The way you’re coming across to me, and maybe you don’t mean it, is trying to make us feel sorry for Cork’s setup. If we say such and such a thing happens in Wx you’ll say But, but, but…we’re worse down here blah de blah Frank this Frank that.
Most counties have to take shit from the CB. Think of hurlers from Mayo, Donegal, Leitrim etc-these were treated a lot more like second, third class during their playing days-they never went on strike, they never refused to play for their county, they never asked to choose their manager.
In the past, Cork may have been neutral people’s favourite team-never again I’d say.
[quote=“Pikeman”]
In the past, Cork may have been neutral people’s favourite team-never again I’d say.[/quote]
were you like that Pikeman 
but yeah, a master league fixtures thing was set up in Wexford last year, and at the very first problem it went out the window and was ignored.
as I said in my earlier post, players play, and delgates debate and administrate. Things shouldnt be changed. Players did this all wrong, and if they didnt want GMC back, they should have raised it with a motion and discussed it first without waiting until appointment and then striking.
[quote=“Pikeman”]A master fixtures list was sought in Wexford too manys a time. Always pretty much shot down.
Croke Park set up some committee to look at club fixtures set up in each county to try sort all of this.
The way you’re coming across to me, and maybe you don’t mean it, is trying to make us feel sorry for Cork’s setup. If we say such and such a thing happens in Wx you’ll say But, but, but…we’re worse down here blah de blah Frank this Frank that.
Most counties have to take shit from the CB. Think of hurlers from Mayo, Donegal, Leitrim etc-these were treated a lot more like second, third class during their playing days-they never went on strike, they never refused to play for their county, they never asked to choose their manager.
In the past, Cork may have been neutral people’s favourite team-never again I’d say.[/quote]
I don’t feel sorry for myself or for Cork, i’m the type of person who would do something about it, put my future roles in GAA in jepordy to get to an end. I don’t have the power or support to get really involved as yet, but i will eventually. If thats a millitant position i have to take up then i will.
Believe me i know its not the only place with the trouble, but its being highlighted at the moment. Maybe it will get others thinking, even if they don’t agree with the Cork players. That in itself is something.
As HBV said, if the players got rid of Frank and Ger Mac then maybe alot of other things would be forgotten about. I believe thats where people like myself would come in. I’m not arrogant enough to think i can influence this situation, but as has been said here time and time again, i do have my club, and thats the vechicle i will use to gradually get certain things changed.
The one thing is though, ye all say that its similar elsewhere, but ye are quite willing to accept that. I’m not sure is that because ye aren’t directly involved anymore or what.
Whatever you say about the Cork players, they certainly can’t be accused of not trying to change old habbits, either rightly or wrongly.
[quote=“caoimhaoin”]The one thing is though, ye all say that its similar elsewhere, but ye are quite willing to accept that. I’m not sure is that because ye aren’t directly involved anymore or what.
Whatever you say about the Cork players, they certainly can’t be accused of not trying to change old habbits, either rightly or wrongly.[/quote]
thats not true at all. No one accepts mediocrity. Wexford are gone to shite lately, and we’re hardly happy about things. I put forward a fixture proposal this year, and because they couldnt get a consesus on one proposal, they just left things the way they are. The clubs took the chairman up on his actions over the sacking of John Myler.
There are problems in every county, and if you think Cork have the worst, then you are seriously mistaken. Despite all Corks ‘problems’ they are still at the moment the best dual county in Ireland. Spare a thought for Carlow, who have clubs fighting and players who wont play if another club player is on the panel. Mayo who have had nearly all their hurling budget taken away from them. Other counties have far bigger problems than Cork.
But there are ways of dealing with problems. Players striking is not the right way. Fair enough, the players want to change things, but there was a way for them to do it, and they went and fooked it right up.
[quote=“Gman”]thats not true at all. No one accepts mediocrity. Wexford are gone to shite lately, and we’re hardly happy about things. I put forward a fixture proposal this year, and because they couldnt get a consesus on one proposal, they just left things the way they are. The clubs took the chairman up on his actions over the sacking of John Myler.
There are problems in every county, and if you think Cork have the worst, then you are seriously mistaken. Despite all Corks ‘problems’ they are still at the moment the best dual county in Ireland. Spare a thought for Carlow, who have clubs fighting and players who wont play if another club player is on the panel. Mayo who have had nearly all their hurling budget taken away from them. Other counties have far bigger problems than Cork.
But there are ways of dealing with problems. Players striking is not the right way. Fair enough, the players want to change things, but there was a way for them to do it, and they went and fooked it right up.[/quote]
Gman - I’m not having a go at you directly, and it would be silly to get into a tit-for-tat about who’s county is more fucked up. i think we both have the same interests, and have the same ideals at heart.
The fixtures and club problems i think should be kept seperate from the players dispute. Its just some of the same people are involved.
I think i’ve talked enough about it now, gotten it off my chest as you would say. Back to the IOTY comp!!!
[quote=“caoimhaoin”]Gman - I’m not having a go at you directly, and it would be silly to get into a tit-for-tat about who’s county is more fucked up. i think we both have the same interests, and have the same ideals at heart.
The fixtures and club problems i think should be kept seperate from the players dispute. Its just some of the same people are involved.
I think i’ve talked enough about it now, gotten it off my chest as you would say. Back to the IOTY comp!!![/quote]
I understand that alright Kev, and dont worry, it would take a lot more for me to think you were having a go at me! I know what you are trying to say in all this, but I dont think at all that the end result (if their is one) justify the means.
the players could have done all this so so differently, and for the outside, it looks like there is an agenda with them, given that this is their 3rd strike, and seeing as there has only ever been 3 strikes in the GAA it makes them look worse.
No one is publicly after saying what happened at the manager reappointment meeting. There was 2 players on that committee. They siad that they werent heard. Did they actually tell the committee that they would oppose GMC and that they wanted other candidates to come forward? They could well have, I dont know. But this should have been dealt with a long time ago if they were not happy with the manager.
Some Wexford players were unhappy with their manager, and after a couple of meetings, the chairman (in the wrong manner) sacked Myler without any debate. Now whilst in the long run, this was the best decision, he should have done it properly and brought it to the board without steaming ahead on his own conviction.
i personally dont see how the players actions are doing Crok hurling any good whatsoever. They crossed a line. And to me, whilst I suppose I was never particularily fond of a lot of them, as pikeman says above, many others now will not like them at all after all this.
[quote=“Gman”]I understand that alright Kev, and dont worry, it would take a lot more for me to think you were having a go at me! I know what you are trying to say in all this, but I dont think at all that the end result (if their is one) justify the means. Agree with you here
the players could have done all this so so differently, and for the outside, it looks like there is an agenda with them, given that this is their 3rd strike, and seeing as there has only ever been 3 strikes in the GAA it makes them look worse. Agree with you here aswell
No one is publicly after saying what happened at the manager reappointment meeting. There was 2 players on that committee. They siad that they werent heard. Did they actually tell the committee that they would oppose GMC and that they wanted other candidates to come forward? They could well have, I dont know. But this should have been dealt with a long time ago if they were not happy with the manager. They did come out with this during the Q&A at the statement the other night, in fact they really went into detail. They state they never opposed Ger Mac at the start, and agreed he should be asked of his interest. They wanted a process put in, and other candidates would go through this. There was names mentioned, even by members of the CB.It was after this when the CB pushed for a vote (on one candidate) that they let it known their feelings on Ger Mac. They also said that all of the people in the meeting would have known of most of these problems anyway, from either being around the camp, or actually being related to players. I believe the players on this.
Some Wexford players were unhappy with their manager, and after a couple of meetings, the chairman (in the wrong manner) sacked Myler without any debate. Now whilst in the long run, this was the best decision, he should have done it properly and brought it to the board without steaming ahead on his own conviction. I agree, but i can also see where they might be coming from. He isn’t the most plesant manager in the world, i was at CIT for a year training with Fitz team, i would have been on the edge of team and was only filling in really in league games, what a prick he is to players like myself. I’m not a terrible hurler or anything. he also had that Landers incident. While it was dealt with badly, i had fuck all sympathy.
i personally dont see how the players actions are doing Crok hurling any good whatsoever. They crossed a line. And to me, whilst I suppose I was never particularily fond of a lot of them, as pikeman says above, many others now will not like them at all after all this. I think in time people will like tem again. Imagine if this 2009 panel made something of themselves, i think everyone would root for them. They are unbelievable underdogs now. I myself even at my age wouldn’t fear marking many of them young fellas. In fact i would go as far as saying some of them might end up like me, filling in for league games on the edge of a Fitzgibbon panel.[/quote]
kevo, how come if this is all down to 2001/2 that they didn’t come out fighting in 05 when they had 2 AIs and the support of everyine ? why now when their powers are very much on the wane?
also if they got rid of ger mac, frank etc do you seriously thnk they would win the AI in 09 ?
Anyway, Cork team for Sunday…
Cork - 2009 NFL V Meath: A Quirke; M Shields, N O Donovan, A Lynch; N O’ Leary, G Canty, J Miskella; A O Connor, P O Neill; C McCarthy, F Goold, P Kelly; D Goulding, M Cussen, D O Connor.
Bench: Kevin Murphy, Ger Spillane, Paul Kerrigan, Paul Flynn, Andrew O’Sullivan, Ray Carey, John Hayes, Kevin O’Sullivan.
Might have it tough against Meath. Don’t know much about O’ Donovan, I would have Shields pencilled in for full back, but I guess anyone’s better then that idiot Kanvanagh (no Duggan either mercifully). Strong center back line. Alan O’Connor given yet more opportuinities in midfield, seems to be a bizarre favourite of the selectors. Center forward line looks dodgy - Goold’s a lightwieght, McCarthy an often clueless workhorse and don’t know much about Kelly. If the full forward line gets the right ball though, they’ll destroy Meath. Hopefully Kerrigan and the two O’Sullivan’s get some decent game time, talented players.
Considering the amount of players to come back, its a pretty decent team. Hopefully, come Munster Championship time, the likes of Duggan, A O’Connor, Kavanagh and Spillane won’t be anywhere near the first 15.
Any chance this is on TV?