yeah as far as I know. dont know what exactly he does though.
:lol:
So Mick your really thinking ahead country on its knees and you want to rearrange , the Dail sitting times so you and boys can watch the football are you taking drugs ?, Mick TD,s only turn up for the minim amount of time required to get there allowances 75,days not full days just sign in , sure Harney get an allowance for theD ail gym ,the only gym she uses is jim beam ,it s a bleeding joke ,quangos my arse , one other point ,would not be more worried about 40 million that you owe that the football ,just a point ,you,ll probably have a few of them watching the match ,get your Priority’s in order
shame on the lot of you ,
John Giles is singing out Off The Ball tonight to celebrate our advancement to Euro 2012. Coming up shortly.
The only gym she uses is Jim beam
Quality
Maybe electing hairy wasn’t a good idea after all
His song is ‘Don’t Cry for me Argentina’ apparently. He also revealed that Liam Brady’s number is ‘Ruby Don’t Take Your Love to Town’
Yeah, he had mentioned those particular songs earlier in the programme but he actually sang You’ll Never Walk Alone. Not a dry eye in my living room.
That knob Richie Sadlier has done an about turn on Trap in the Sindo today. I’m off to Twitter to have a go at him.
Silencing the chorus of boos
[font=Verdana]By Eamonn Sweeney[/font]
[font=Verdana]Sunday November 20 2011[/font]
[font=Verdana]Most of the talk about Ireland’s qualification for next year’s European Championships seems to centre on the joys which await us in the future. Yet while it’s well worth anticipating the spring which the tournament will put in our national sporting step next summer, the successful conclusion to the campaign is also significant as marking the end of an era.[/font]
[font=Verdana]And a peculiarly unlovely and dispiriting era it was too, one during which the members of our national soccer team became the butt of ridicule and abuse to an extent which had never happened previously. To judge by the joyous scenes at the Aviva Stadium on Tuesday night, we have fallen back in love with the team and qualification has drawn a line under the unhappy recent past. It’s about time.[/font]
[font=Verdana]The process by which the team turned from national darlings to something approaching national pariahs can be traced back almost ten years to Saipan where we endured our own version of The Dreyfus Affair. Yet, oddly enough, in the immediate aftermath of the 2002 World Cup the boil seemed to have been lanced thanks to a series of spirited performances in the tournament.[/font]
[font=Verdana]Then defeats by Russia and Switzerland[/url] were followed by the resignation of [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Mick_McCarthy”]Mick McCarthy[/url]. There was also the publication of [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Roy_Keane”]Roy Keane[/url]'s autobiography, a terrific read in which ghost-writer [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Eamon_Dunphy_%28footballer%29”]Eamon Dunphy[/url] demonstrated his enviable powers of invective and recast the [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Manchester_United”]Manchester United[/url] star’s falling out with [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Mick_McCarthy”]McCarthy[/url] as a kind of crusade against national mediocrity. That [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Reading_Football_Club”]reading[/url] of the Saipan affair became a highly influential one. It seemed to strike a chord with the zeitgeist of the [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Celtic_FC”]Celtic[/url] Tiger era, [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Keane%2C_Inc.”]Keane’s bullishness appealing to everyone who liked to see themselves as fearlessly thinking outside the box or pushing the envelope.[/font]
[font=Verdana]All of a sudden Mick McCarthy was berated for being insufficiently ambitious. Ireland[/url], we were informed, should be going to World Cups looking to win the tournament. And, astoundingly, the [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Jack_Charlton”]Jack Charlton[/url] teams which had probably given this nation its greatest moments of collective joy suffered a kind of retrospective devaluation as they were berated for not living up to some Platonic ideal of sparkling football which no-one had ever actually seen an Irish team play. It was a bit like complaining that your wife doesn’t look like [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Nicole_Kidman”]Nicole Kidman without copping on that if she did look like Nicole Kidman she probably wouldn’t be your wife.[/font]
[font=Verdana]It was open season on not just the national team but on the FAI in general and John Delaney[/url] in particular. Brian [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Brian_Kerr”]Kerr had been a hugely popular figure within the game before he succeeded McCarthy as manager but the general air of dissatisfaction meant no mercy was shown when he narrowly missed out on qualification for the 2006 World Cup. An apparently embittered Kerr, Keane-like, joined the army of snipers on the sidelines. The stage was set for the farce of the Staunton era.[/font]
[font=Verdana]Yet even during those disastrous years some of the criticism seemed wildly disproportionate. Both rugby and Gaelic games were used as sticks to beat soccer with. Pundits who should have known better consoled themselves for their disappointment over the GAA’s Faustian pact with the FAI which let soccer on to the hallowed ground of Croke Park by yammering on interminably about the superiority of the noble breed who played Gaelic football and hurling.[/font]
[font=Verdana]The idea that someone who got paid for playing sport was somehow intrinsically inferior to someone who didn’t got a regular run-out in those quarters. It was as though we were back in the era when English cricket sniffily divided participants into Gentlemen and Players. There were even suggestions that success for the soccer team might not necessarily be a good thing because it might lure GAA players away from their native games.[/font]
[font=Verdana]A perfect storm of negativity held sway. Just after Staunton finally resigned, I met John Delaney. He’d just finished reading an article which said that the only world-class coaches in Irish sport were those involved in Gaelic football and hurling. It was, he pointed out, an argument too stupid to refute. Meanwhile, we got chapter and verse in the papers about the sick culture inhabited by professional soccer players. The spectacle of Robbie Keane having a few pints and singing a song in the pub had to be inflated into a moral tale for our times, an indictment of both the player and his game.[/font]
You’d have presumed that Trapattoni’s CV meant we’d have given him credit for knowing something about football. Not a bit of it. The man was a fossil who was actually holding our players back and preventing them from playing that famous sparkling brand of football which lay dormant somewhere within the team’s psyche. One night on RTE Eamon Dunphy said that we had some of the best players in Europe. Poor Liam Brady nearly fell off his chair.
[font=Verdana]In reality, Trapattoni was doing well with a limited bunch of footballers yet as recently as theSlovakia[/url] game just over two months ago the team was booed by their fans at the Aviva. Sometimes the last ten years can seem like one chorus of boos after another. With these shouts of derision ringing in their ears, Ireland went to Russia and battled heroically for a point. Next up came [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Armenia”]Armenia[/url] and [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Estonia”]Estonia. The era of negativity was about to end.[/font]
[font=Verdana]There can be no arguing with the magnitude of Trap’s achievement. Ireland were the lowest ranked team to qualify. At the time the draw was made we stood 25th in Europe. The next lowest ranked team to make it through were the Danes in 16th. Switzerland (13), Serbia (14) and Turkey (15) won’t be there but Ireland will.[/font]
[font=Verdana]In the end the manager’s big decisions were vindicated, sometimes spectacularly so. Simon Cox[/url] was a controversial choice to start as striker against Armenia. He ended as man of the match. Jon Walters seemed an odd choice to lead the line out in Estonia but he also had an outstanding game. Our best player in Tallinn was [url=“http://searchtopics.independent.ie/topic/Keith_Andrews_%28footballer%29”]Keith Andrews, the guy whose presence in the team ahead of Andy Reid once irked so many people (I was one of them). Andrews may not have the natural talent of Reid or Ireland but he bought into the system, grew in stature and repaid Trapattoni’s faith fivefold.[/font]
[font=Verdana]You know who else has been vindicated? John Delaney for his bold decision in appointing Trap. And Denis O’Brien for making sure we had the money to do so. It sticks in some people’s craws to praise either but credit where credit is due.[/font]
[font=Verdana]We’ll have a lot of fun next summer. The country needs this at a time when our morale has taken blow after blow, at a time which is spookily reminiscent of those dire '80s days which were enlivened by Jack Charlton’s great team. Saying it doesn’t matter whether we have international success because we always have the GAA is to be ludicrously parochial. And rugby, though it’s grown hugely in popularity in recent years, still doesn’t attract the same level of support that the national soccer team does when it reaches a major tournament, something we’ve only done on four previous occasions.[/font]
[font=Verdana]Perhaps the nattering nabobs of negativity will try to persuade us that the jury is out on Trapattoni until we see how the team does in Poland and the Ukraine. It would be a crafty face-saving move because we might well be the weakest team there. But I don’t think anyone will fall for it at this stage. The man was hired to get us to the finals and that is what he has done. The dog days are over.[/font]
[font=Verdana]And thank God for that.[/font]
Excellent article, very honest too which is good to see. So many journo’s try to mask their “wrongness” about certain things.
Some of us got it spectacularly wrong in some ways with Trap and this team. Its a fucking serious achievement the more you think about it.
Fair play Kev. Would you also accept your criticism of Robbie Keane and claiming he was a bad dressing room influence was incorrect? His leadership has been wonderful in this campaign.
Good article alright and I look forward to a flood of apologies from those who most fervent in their criticism.
Did he bite Bandage ?
I decided against baiting him in the end. Trap’s won. No need to kick this prick Sadlier when he’s already down having made a fool of himself.
poor article. talk about a volte face - http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/vendetta-is-an-italian-word-2382953.html
its the sindo so playing to the gallery is their trademark. No surprise he has supporters here then.
Roy Keane’s biography was a poor read and suffered from the influence of Dunphy. Dont think that book was an influential one either. The die was well and truly cast by then anyway. There was an emotional outburst from Dunphy around that time, we should be going to the Euros to win it, (Euro 2004) that had everyone talking if I recall correctly.
The author does raise an interesting point about the bullishness of the Celtic Tiger era where there was a crusade against national mediocrity. This in a short space of time has turned full circle where now we are in dreamland for just qualifying. I still dont see anything wrong with striving to be the best you can be. Maybe that is unfashionable now where every success is of the type that will lift the mood of the nation. I think even this group of Irish players should expect to finish second in the last 2 groups. I think with any decent manager we would have frankly. Not to take away from Trap but it isnt the achievement people are making it out to be.
Brian Kerr didnt deserve any sympathy. He had been given pretty much two campaigns with a decent side and failed to make the playoffs at either stage. The Steve Staunton/Bobby Robson circus showed appalling judgement from the tie throwing Alan Partridge character. The author make irrelevant references to the GAA. Our soccer players did deserve criticism at the time. Particularly those who are being lauded to the hills now were dire under Kerr and Staunton. Dunne and Keane being prime examples.I think the point to raise is that maybe we shouldnt be too harsh on our sportstars when things are going too bad, Id argue we shouldnt be showering them with undying love now that we have qualified either.
Dunphy’s laughable point about us having some of the best players in Europe was knocked back by Graeme Souness not Liam Brady who was on the Irish bench at the time. The Slovakia game was the nadir alright but the reaction may have been over the top. Please see his article above for the de facto Sino reactionary horseshit. Andy Reid wasnt getting his game for Blackpool probably at the time.
No one is arguing against the limitations of our side but lets have a look at the opposition that stood in the way of the Irish side this time out. Slovakia (ranked 41st), Armenia (ranked 46th), Estonia (ranked 59th). If you want to use rankings as a benchmark you would have to say that Ireland should be expecting to qualify for the Euros based on the opposition we faced. Trap and the players deserve congratulations for getting the job done but it also needs to be stated that this was one of the softest draws we have ever had. Id argue it is not a serious achievement to have beaten that lot to qualify.
Where Trap has got it right is on his individual picks. The performances of Cox and Walters have been overstated I feel but both have certainly justified the manager’s decisions. They were big calls too. He has done it before aswell bringing in the likes of St.Ledger for the game in Sofia. Furthermore the clamour to have the likes of Reid, Coleman, McCarthy in the side is a bit bogus now based on their club form to date. Trap has clearly got it right here and doesnt overreact to a run of good club form. Id argue he should have given Reid the chance at the time, his fall from grace down to being a sub at championship level means he can only point the finger at himself as to why things havent worked out.
John Delaney appointed a committee to recommend a managerial appointment after Kerr and Staunton didnt work out. The committee was merely imo a face-saving exercise if Trap didnt work out. Maybe it is to Houghton and Givens we should applaud or more likely Liam Brady for convincing him to sign up to one of the most lucrative international gigs. Certainly not the Alan Partridge wannabe. I’m not sure we are at the stage of applauding those who were found to be buying state politicans yet.
I suggested he may have been at club level, never said anything about with Ireland. It still remains Bando that he put in some dreadful performances for Ireland, acted like a child on occasion and in my personal opinion didn’t fulfill his true potential. I believe this may have something to do with his constant moving, he was an unsettled chap in fairness. It was blatantly obvious that anytime Robbie got a run of games he was one of the best around. Then something would happen, often arguably not his fault (injury). I say arguably as his conditioning was not always 100% and this may have led to injury, but thats hard to know.
His performances for Ireland in an overall sense make him a legend, stats alone bore that out. But his recent leadership and maturity on and off the field has to be commended. He has been superb really, as they all have, but i think from reading between the lines the rest of the squad have a very high regard for Robbie and his leadership.
Keanes book may not have been superbly written, but it was hugely informative and interesting. It also did have a massive affect on what people thought of the whole situation.
I agree though fellas saying we should go back to being happy with moral victories etc is crap. We should always aim to win anything we enter. Aim low, finish lower.
The rankings argument is a bit circular because the current rankings are a function of the fact that we finished ahead of the teams we were competing against. The fact is we were seeded third and had a relatively easy second seed to compete against. But they were a team that made the knockout stages of the World Cup just two years ago, as well as having a handful of very good players. I said from the start that I thought it was a decent draw - and it was - but it was still a worthy achievement.
I think it’s been a bit of a blow to lazy Irish journalists who watch the Premiership on RTÉ on a Saturday night and form opinions on that basis alone. (I obviously don’t include Dunphy here because he sometimes watches La Liga on Sky apparently). These columnists have had a few “causes” over the course of the last couple of years - as you highlighted: Reid, McCarthy, Coleman - and they’ve been all based on watching some highlights and drawing conclusions based on that alone. Trap has all those players training with him and has made his own assessment which he has right. That’s not to say there’s no future for McCarthy or Coleman but they haven’t done enough yet to warrant inclusion despite their popularity.
Interesting to see the same now bubbling up around Hoolahan. He’s a player I like and I’ve been suggesting he’d be good to have in the squad for a couple of years. He’s now on RTÉ every Saturday night (when he’s picked) so he’s the current favourite son of those who want change for change’s sake. I’m not sure he could ever play in Trap’s system though - he can’t play in a 4-4-2 and a 4-5-1 isn’t likely to happen until Keane fades, if ever.
Big article about Trap in the Polish paper today. That man has an incredible managing pedigree. Didn’t know he played with Milan.
Saw Hoolahan again at the weekend. Think I mentioned it on another thread but he was withdrawn long before the end again. Good on the ball but you could drive a bus through their midfield. He needs a free role. I can’t think of s single player being hard done by at the moment. Clark and Gibson are definitely good enough to be involved but they have got to be playing regularly at club level to have a chance. I’d have huge doubts about Coleman and McCarthy and reckon Trap has it right on the pair of them. Keith Fahey is another tidy player who has done well for us and you have Dunphy screaming for his involvement. I always thought he was decent if a little lightweight for Brum. Though if you look at Villa forums he is the one Brum player ridiculed more than most for being crap. Considering the players they have had it’s some doing but it gives you an idea of how people who watch these cause célèbres regularly think of them rather than Dunphys highlights package.
That is a valid point, read somewhere over the weekend we have gone from 25th on the Uefa Co-effient list to 12th. If the WC 2014 qualifying draw had taken place in the coming months like it used as opposed to the early draw they have had this time round to we would be comfortably second seeds.