I half listened to the second half or the end of this. It was pathetic stuff. I thought OâBrien was the worse of the two of them for interrupting and not allowing responses and O Broin responded in kind. Still seems obvious to me that O Broin has by far a stronger understanding of what to do and will to do it whereas FF/FG are never going to take on vested interests and so will never do more than tinker round the edges.
Watched half of it. Iâd say the Minister was expecting a tougher night if it
Neither were very convincing
OâBroin is a chancer. Have you actually read his book? The SF âsumsâ on new builds are pure spoofery, they basically move costs from one bucket to another and claim you are making housing cheaper when it is nothing of the sort.
Anyone who goes around talking about wanting âFrank McDonaldâs Dublinâ doesnât care about affordability or the environment.
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the andrews rifles are circling
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I mean thatâs just the reality. Frank prattles on about Paris and Haussmann architecture ignoring that;
- Paris is still one of the most expensive cities in the world
- Paris has La DĂ©fense
- Haussmannâs Paris and the raising of those building heights to the âoptimumâ 6-8 came because a Dictator decided he wanted better aesthetics and kicked the poor out of their homes
- the floor levels in Georgian Dublin are fixed where they are and you canât be raising floor heights generally without trading off height to conservation
He hates the Metro because he has a preference for another project. Similarly he tried to campaign against the Dublin City Library moving to Parnell Square as part of a rejuvenation because he wanted it in the old Central Bank. Coincidentally the old Central Bank is around the corner from where he lives.
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Pity there were no NIMBYs around when Georgian Dublin was constructed, complaining these buildings werenât in keeping with the area
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a bit of a post hoc ergo propter hoc to that post.
so which of the other expensive cities in the top 20 have a haussmann type of layout? also most of the other top 20 cities dont have a la defence type of layout for modernist buildings so the haussmann argument seems to be a bit of a strawman
Does that make it not optimal for planning purposes now? Seems an irrelevant point Tim.
Straw man for what? Iâm dealing with Frank McDonaldâs obsession with Paris.
That obsession is not actually borne out of affordability, itâs on aesthetics. Something I can completely understand but if you are styling yourself on fixing a housing crisis then you shouldnât be following a FMD.
One of Frankâs latest rages was against a development on Townsend Street that got rid of Nedâs early house. He of course mentioned the hotel gone in there but conveniently ignored that there is 21 brand new social houses in the development.
Frankâs Dublin is going on an occasional walking tour of a Herbert Simms 1930s council block and swooning at the features, agreeing with one another that they must all be retained. Meanwhile the residents live with rats and mice everywhere and sub optimal facilities.
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Itâs not irrelevant.
You canât talk about the âoptimalâ height of a city and ignore the reality that central Dublin retains an 18th century core whilst the rest of Europe has a far higher proportion of higher 19th and 20th century stock.
Dublin has a low âshoulder heightâ. You therefore have tradeoffs to get that up when utilising the existing core infrastructure of things like the DART. Itâs either that or more sprawl.
We get that youâd prefer Johnny Ronan Dublin.
Iâm sure thereâs flaws to be found in most peopleâs plans or visions. I think McDonaldâs vision is far preferable to what we have at the moment. If there is a vision itâs that of Owen Keegan and Eoghan Murphy 
Your dictator reference is entirely irrelevant, a weak effort to discredit. Apart from the Georgian areas you speak of is it possible that 6 to 8 stories would work well across much of the rest of the city? (Yes)
I didnât say that, but Ronan has done far more for Dublin than McDonaldâs army of NIMBYs.
Frankâs vision for Dublin needs to be explained. We cannot get Parisian style density without demolishing Georgian Dublin or sprawl.
Maybe when all that happens weâll get to the Utopia of being the 8th most expensive city, up from 11thâŠ
https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2020/1214/1184385-expensive-cities/
Or maybe weâll improve from 5th most expensive place to rent to 6th, like Paris
https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2020/0401/1127733-rents/
It seems you would like to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world.
that ronan has done anything for dublin is purely a coincidence
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Where? On existing public transport lines? The Docklands is already full of those 6-8 floor stumps. There are 2-3 sites left.
You canât answer that.
In terms of âtrying to discreditâ, I am setting the scene on how Paris came to be. It was on the whims of the wealthy. In fact Dublin was not altogether different with the Wide Street Commission.
Your goal is for Dublin to go from 5th to 6th most expensive city, very far reachingâŠ
A coincidence of what? Frank would have hated the people who built and lived in Georgian Dublin at the time as well bud.
Frankâs legacy to Dublin is objecting to developments (including public transport) and the horrendous 1980s pastiche red brick crap all over the city that himself and his buddies wanted.
Roman built the Convention Centre and some of the core buildings that house Irelandâs tech industry.
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I find Timâs posts on planning and housing odd. Loaded with presumptions and straw men. Slanted nearly to vertical. Youâd wonder what his skin in the game is.
One of the worst buildings Iâve ever seen
Iâm presenting arguments. Can you answer questions?
You arenât really. You state your presumptions as facts, I think theyâre all wrong.