When has Downes done it in the heat of championship hurling? 2011 was the last time.
He hasnāt had an extended run of fitness in a long while, itās fair point but I wouldnāt have him in his civvies, sure itās all idle talk anyway
Itās absolutely bizarre in limerick youāve serial winners like gillane, morrissey etc who been given their first chance at this level and taken it with both hands, answered nearly all the questions asked of them, gained promotion, kept their heads down and have worked extremely hard yet everyone on here has cribbed and grabbed their performances and looked for any excuse to see them dropped for lads that have been given serveral chances over the last 7 seasons and never taken them. Time to move on.
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Not enough cut about him.
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Not Gillane, never read a bad word about him on TFK
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Pat will be one of the first subs in the forwards. Pace and a knack for goals.
Whatās your definition of serial winners?? Morrisey with two AIU21 medals and Gillane with one plus a Fitzgibbon? I havenāt seen any cribbing about Gillane and while thereās been a bit about Morrisey everyone is entitled to their opinion. In my view Morrisey has come on a tonne this year but I would still have concerns about him on faster going over the summer.
Gillane also won a senior county. People were looking for him to be dropped a month ago.
Fair play for the nuanced change in emphasis, lads. No longer arguing over starting lineups, itās moved onto the order of subs to be used. 
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Our panel is deeper than yours.
Not subs any moreā¦its finishers
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Lads who have an u21 all Ireland medal and a county club championship medal are āserial winnersā but lads with harty medals, munster u21 medals, Munster senior medals, multiple county championships, multiple Munster club medals, and an all Ireland club medal are pure losers these days. You couldnāt make it up.
Thatās the way itās gone these days with the sky sports and the social media.
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No Iām saying thereās absolutley no reason for these lads to be dropped. Downes has had 7 years to prove heās at the required level. He hasnāt. Time to move on.
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Thatās absolute bollox
Yes they were.
This is true, and what Bod said above is also true. Despite Kiely picking more or less the same 15 in every League game, it is more about a panel than ever before. There will be changes to the team from week to week for various reasons- be it form or injury or tactical reasons versus the various opposition. I mean Allen did this in 2013 but the difference now is that we have so much more options; maybe not 26 but 23 or 24 anywayā¦ nothing against the man, but I donāt think Hennessy comes close to Quaid in goals. And I think weāre a bit light in the half-back line. If we had more options, Byrnes might have been dropped for a game. But itās been Byrnes/Hannon/Morrissey for practically every game with Paddy OāLoughlin as main sub. Itās the one position where the NaP lads donāt offer a huge amount of cover- I donāt think Alan Dempsey will make it there, Kiely has never picked Ronan Lynch as a half-back even in 2016 when it made sense to. Grimes might replace OāLoughlin as the sub but there are better half-backs in the county than both (although weāre playing a lot of them in the forwards).
As you know, Iāve always been a big fan of Downes but while he still has the pace & the power; the rawness and mistakes that were forgivable in a 19-year-old are still present in a 26-year-old. He still runs into traffic, he still takes on crazy shotsā¦ when heās good, heās very good but his decision-making is sub-par and youāll be crucified for that at intercounty level. Now he could still be a good impact player but is he better at that than Nash, who is very similar to him? I donāt know.
But it is about a 26-man panel now and players will fulfil different roles. Thereās no point in me saying I want to see Malachy or Kyle in the half-back line or OāDonovan in midfield because realistically, itās not going to happen.
The 26 I expect to see on the first day of Championship, presuming everyone is fit:
Quaid, Hennessy
Finn, Hickey, English, Casey, McCarthy
Byrnes, Hannon, Morrissey, Grimes
Lynch, Browne, Malachy
Kyle, Morrissey, Hegarty, DOD, Dempsey, Dowling
Casey, Flanagan, Gillane, Murphy, Pat Ryan
Thatās 25- the last player will be WOD or Reidy or Mulcahy imo.
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Nail on the head.
And Iām just pointing out that your definition of a serial winner is specious and stupid.
It really doesnāt matter what age a player is if he comes good and is in form he should be picked. Weāve been over your view of downes before, at least half his years since first involved were laid waste by injury, but you can continue with your simplistic view because you are a simpleton. Thereās plenty examples of Limerick players coming in and having a big impact in their later years, no doubt youād never have picked the Ryan or the Moran brothers in their later years either.
No Iām pointing out these lads have won at every level and at their first chance at senior level theyāve taken it with both hands. Unlike the vast majority of lads that have lined up for limerick over the past twenty years.
Itās futile I know but I wonder how weād see things if the Well had NaPās run, Iād be surprised if Gillane was getting much mention here, same goes for all the teams