Munster Rugby - We DID start the fire (Part 1)

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

Yup but signing saffers isn’t going to solve that problem

[gilgamboa]

@tallback

Munsters problem is that the bish-bosh style of play will get you so far but not past the big teams. Grand for Pro14 and a good chunk of the HEC but come up against a Leinster/Exeter/Racing and you usually need more. Hence they reach the same stage every year.

Munster played the most ambitious rugby they have in years this season… But reverted to type in the games against Leinster for some fucking reason

[tallback]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

Yup but signing saffers isn’t going to solve that problem

Totally agreed

[LionelRitchie]

That’s almost more infuriating isn’t it? Go out and lose playing that style and I can accept. A loss but heading right direction. Instead they took a backward step and got dismissed like a ginger step child.

[tallback]

@gilgamboa

@tallback

Munsters problem is that the bish-bosh style of play will get you so far but not past the big teams. Grand for Pro14 and a good chunk of the HEC but come up against a Leinster/Exeter/Racing and you usually need more. Hence they reach the same stage every year.

Munster played the most ambitious rugby they have in years this season… But reverted to type in the games against Leinster for some fucking reason

Is that game plan or players under pressure regressing?

Benching Murray for the Leinster game would have been some statement of intent as to what the gameplan was

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

Not the old school out and out 7, flexible backrows. Essentially there is 3 of the same position depending on the game the team is planning on playing. The days of players like POM CJ SOB ferris are gone

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

Looking the teamsheet, horses for courses. No such thing as a first xv anymore just the best xv for the next opponent. Guaranteed starters is a terrible policy. It’s not as much a game of skill and talent bit more a game of chess to utilise the best players woth the most suitable skillset to win the next game. All based around the shape and patterns you play

[gilgamboa]

@tallback

Is that game plan or players under pressure regressing?

Clear game plan decision IMO

[gilgamboa]

Listened to the rte rugby podcast there with Jackman and Lenihan.

Uncle Donal didn’t spare the rod… And when Uncle Donal is putting the welly into Munster things are bad… And I’d be nervous listening to that if I was JVG

[LionelRitchie]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

Not the old school out and out 7, flexible backrows. Essentially there is 3 of the same position

They’re not. That’s been said for 20 years. You see Will Connors ever playing at 6? VDF?
Or say Wallabies Captain Hooper?

Look at every world cup won. The 7 is close to world player of the year, of not the actual winner, the year they win the cup.

it’s weird how we in Munster ignore such a vital position and think it can be filled by a 6. In a game where split seconds count, the 7 is crucial.

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

I disagree, they have the same game plan but if you look at the decision made by key players within the pattern of play is whats dictating the game. Scrum half is the most obvious example. When Murray broke a big 9 taking the ball to the line attacking between piller and firts defender was the rage, you had a pod running an attack line off it forcing a decision from the defender to go for 9 and leave a gap for the pass or bite at the pod allowing the 9 through. Nowadays teams defend this area well but stack it with players. Casey is very quick at moving the ball taking these defenders out of the game. Dont get me started on box kicking.

Cj and POM rarely sweep to a player out the back, its carry to the line and make hard yards, maybe get an offload. Younger guys are sweeping out the back of the defence is up hard, if the defensive line is slow they carry looking for an offload in contact.

Small margins of change that effect the game

[gilgamboa]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

I disagree, they have the same game plan but if you look at the decision made by key players within the pattern of play is whats dictating the game. Scrum half is the most obvious example. When Murray broke a big 9 taking the ball to the line attacking between piller and firts defender was the rage, you had a pod running an attack line off it forcing a decision from the defender to go for 9 and leave a gap for the pass or bite at the pod allowing the 9 through.

I don’t agree that it was down to individual player interpretation… But even if it was… Then picking Murray is part of thay decision… And leaving him on for 75 mins if he isn’t playing your desired game plan is part of that decision…

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

They’ve said it but my point is they are stackin game back rows with too many big ball carrying players that are out and out 6 & 8s. I don’t thinkna hooper style player is needed of you balance the back row correctly, even at that with 2 big ball carrying 8s the out and out 7 will be ineffective for the most part.

I understand where your coming from the likes of JOD and TOD are not the answer at 7. You would want a fella closer to a centre than a second row at 7 if you dont have and out and out 7

[LionelRitchie]

@Halfpipe

No matter what the sport, once a team gets a reputation as being a handy option to build the retirement fund its hard to shake that off.

Saracens were the go to Saffer nest egg pad palace going back as far as to the likes of Francois Peinaar. They seemed to shake it off alright…

[Heyyoubehindthebushes]

Its more of an example but look at the selection on Saturday on where the difference is, no fineen wycherly (injured too) kylen is an average player, Murray ahead of Casey, carbary would have been my first choice but jj ahead of heaky on the bench sticks out, Coombes at 6 (the form 8) and POM at 7 (my opinion on him is well known) CJ 8 (swapped with Coombes but doesn’t make much differnce)

Its easy to see what influenced the difference in playing style and reverting to type. They have played and stuck to 1 33 1 all season but deviate on the big match days with the international back. Its like they can’t play different systems with different squads (munster and ireland)

Yet the leinster players can slot in and out of the systems at ease

[gilgamboa]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

Its easy to see what influenced the difference in playing style and reverting to type. They have played and stuck to 1 33 1 all season but deviate on the big match days with the international back. Its like they can’t play different systems with different squads (munster and ireland)

Exactly we changed the game plan

[myboyblue]

@tallback

@Thomas_Brady

Do you root for Munster yet or do you pity them too much still?

It’s funny what D’Arcy said - I’d kinda understand it. It used to be the biggest game - 01 06 09 11 etc. Even the league games in between - I remember being in Musgrave Pk in 06 I think when Munster destroyed Leinster and gave Contepomi dogs abuse.

But now, we just win. That’s it. In all the big games recently you never felt like Munster would win and that’s fairly anti-climatic.

Between this and Dublin GAA, your sports watching must be dreadfully mundane at this stage.

[tallback]

@myboyblue

@tallback

@Thomas_Brady

Do you root for Munster yet or do you pity them too much still?

It’s funny what D’Arcy said - I’d kinda understand it. It used to be the biggest game - 01 06 09 11 etc. Even the league games in between - I remember being in Musgrave Pk in 06 I think when Munster destroyed Leinster and gave Contepomi dogs abuse.

But now, we just win. That’s it. In all the big games recently you never felt like Munster would win and that’s fairly anti-climatic.

Between this and Dublin GAA, your sports watching must be dreadfully mundane at this stage.

Considering I’m a Liverpool supporter too it certainly had a certain regularity to it but this year has brought that losing feeling back!

[flattythehurdler]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

Hodnet Coombes o sullivan

Sounds like a good gonzaga man.

[flattythehurdler]

@Heyyoubehindthebushes

, they have the same game plan but if you look at the decision made by key players within the pattern of play is whats dictating the game. Scrum half is the most obvious example. When Murray broke a big 9 taking the ball to the line attacking between piller and firts defender was the rage, you had a pod running an attack line off it forcing a decision from the defender to go for 9 and leave a gap for the pass or bite at the pod allowing the 9 through.

U wot mate?