[QUOTE=“Boxtyeater, post: 1065327, member: 246”]Anyway, after all that, fair play to Gormley, a great servant to Tyrone. A sneaky hoor, mouthy and well qualified in the dark arts.
He has the 3 Celtic crosses just the same.[/QUOTE]
Spot on.
What’s dumb about this, @carryharry? I don’t like it when idiots hide behind their ratings.
What seperated Kerry and Tyrone from Armagh was that they had players they could bring off the bench that could change the game. Armagh didn’t have the same depth of talent which is why they didn’t win more than the one.
[QUOTE=“Il Bomber Destro, post: 1065388, member: 2533”]What’s dumb about this, @carryharry? I don’t like it when idiots hide behind their ratings.
What seperated Kerry and Tyrone from Armagh was that they had players they could bring off the bench that could change the game. Armagh didn’t have the same depth of talent which is why they didn’t win more than the one.[/QUOTE]
What separates Kerry from Tyrone and Armagh (combined) is tradition, pedigree and 33 All Ireland wins.
That tradition didn’t do much for Kerry when Tyrone were beating them up and down the pitch when they crossed paths in the opening decade of the 00s.
If you do the tally for the opening decade of the 00s, you’ll find Kerry as ever were the kingpins with a not too shoddy haul of 5 All Ireland’s.
Yet they couldn’t get the better of Tyrone when they crossed path on the big days in that decade. It’s a bit like Federer and Nadal, it’s not the quantity that counts, it’s the quality and Tyrone battered them in that decade when they faced off.
I haven’t met a Kerry man yet who’d swop their 37 All Ireland’s for Tyrone’s paltry haul of 3.
Yet, it rankles with a lot of the players of their players that they could never get past Tyrone in Croke Park in that decade.
Every loss rankles in Kerry. They’re never happy down there. That’s the mentality that’s won 37 All Ireland’s. Fellows with 4, 5 & 6 All Ireland medals in Kerry are pissed off because they don’t have 6, 7 or 8.
A large part of the reason Tyrone are still stuck on 3 All Ireland’s is players, management and supporters are still clapping themselves on the back, resting on their laurels thinking they’re great fellows that they won 3 All Ireland’s, the last of which was 7 years ago.
[QUOTE=“Il Bomber Destro, post: 1065253, member: 2533”]In the 2002 All Ireland final with Kerry, Stevie McDonnell was the joint top scorer from play with 0-03 including the winning score.
In the 2003 All Ireland final against Tyrone, McDonnell was the joint top scorer from play with 0-02
In the 2005 All Ireland semi-final against Tyrone, McDonnell was the top scorer from play with 1-03
In the 2006 All Ireland quarter final against Kerry, McDonnell was the top scorer from play with 1-05
Big game, big player.[/QUOTE]
That’s a decent big game scoring record but I’d say Coopers would compare fairly well. Maybe @Manuel Zelaya could throw it up.
Cooper scored goals in 4 different All Ireland Finals - 2004, 2006, 2007 & 2011. Think its only himself and Mikey Sheehy that have done that. Haven’t checked it but I reckon Cooper was probably top or at worst joint top scorer in all four of those All Ireland finals both from play and overall.
[QUOTE=“Manuel Zelaya, post: 1065400, member: 377”]Every loss rankles in Kerry. They’re never happy down there. That’s the mentality that’s won 37 All Ireland’s. Fellows with 4, 5 & 6 All Ireland medals in Kerry are pissed off because they don’t have 6, 7 or 8.
A large part of the reason Tyrone are still stuck on 3 All Ireland’s is players, management and supporters are still clapping themselves on the back, resting on their laurels thinking they’re great fellows that they won 3 All Ireland’s, the last of which was 7 years ago.[/QUOTE]
It’s a massive part of it. Tyrone have produced good underage player in the past 10 years as well but they were never integrated well enough. Harte was far too loyal, an on top of that the CB are far too loyal to him.
Maybe a change in the coaching and the S&C will have a positive effect, but alas now I don’t think they have the quality to be competitive.
If Harte had left after '08 I think Tyrone would be much stronger and higher up the rankings.
He’s struggled against the Ulster teams.
tradition can count for a lot
It did in 1986 when an ageing Kerry team on its last legs beat Tyrone despite only playing well for the last 15minutes. still won by 8pts. pure skill and tradition. Mikey and Pat netting goals with the knees held together by bandage. How did Tyrone not win this? Kerry were beat out the gate the following summer in Killarney by Cork in the replay.
of course this tradition rarely gets mentioned. only the tradition of the 2000s counts for Il Bomber.
What about losing finals though? I seem to remember being good in those games too. He was in the 05 final anyway that I was at. Scored a few brilliant points from play despite being clipped off the ball by the goalie and rugby tackled by canavan at the end.
I’d like to see his overall scoring record in all those big games because as bomber says there’s a view out there he bottled it when the going got tough.
Kerry didn’t even need their greatest all Ireland final goal scorer available to beat the Ulster Champions in the all Ireland final this year!
And the Ulster champions so concerned about a rumour that he might play 5 mins with a busted cruciate some lad was up a tree to spy on Kerry training
Who was the last Ulster player to even play in 4 finals? Peter the great? I think he managed 3. He d be about the only one. You would be going back to the 1960s then for a Down man. Were they in 3 or 4 finals? Il Bomber will have the answer no doubt
[QUOTE=“Tabby, post: 1065412, member: 2142”]What about losing finals though? I seem to remember being good in those games too. He was in the 05 final anyway that I was at. Scored a few brilliant points from play despite being clipped off the ball by the goalie and rugby tackled by canavan at the end.
I’d like to see his overall scoring record in all those big games because as bomber says there’s a view out there he bottled it when the going got tough.[/QUOTE]
Someone threw dust in his eyes as well according to my kerry buddies
[QUOTE=“caoimhaoin, post: 1065408, member: 273”]It’s a massive part of it. Tyrone have produced good underage player in the past 10 years as well but they were never integrated well enough. Harte was far too loyal, an on top of that the CB are far too loyal to him.
Maybe a change in the coaching and the S&C will have a positive effect, but alas now I don’t think they have the quality to be competitive.
If Harte had left after '08 I think Tyrone would be much stronger and higher up the rankings.[/QUOTE]
The Tyrone team that won those 3 All Ireland’s was largely backboned by the minor winning side of 1998/U21 winning side of 2000/01. I never pay too much heed to a one off minor winning team. You won’t build a serious senior team off that generally. If they follow through to U21, well you have a much better chance. I always recall Mick O’Dwyer’s comment that the making of his Kerry side was so many of them losing a minor final to Galway in 1970. Most of those Galway minors of 1970 were never heard of again.
What’s interesting about the minor football championship since 2000 is its thrown up 12 different winners in just 15 seasons. 11 of those Cork (2000), Derry (2002), Laois (2003), Down (2005), Roscommon (2006), Galway (2007), Armagh (2009), Tipperary (2011), Dublin (2012), Mayo (2013), Kerry (2014) were one off winners. The only repeat winners this century are Tyrone who have won 4 in 2001, 2004, 2008 and 2010. Its a damning indictment of Tyrone senior management that off 4 different All Ireland minor winning teams in less than a decade, the only player that’s had a real heavyweight impact at senior level is Sean Cavanagh.
Good question. I’ll have to think about that. It wouldn’t be a Down player as Down famously never lost an All Ireland final until 2010, winning their first 5 All Ireland finals in 1960, 61, 68, 91 & 94. Actually its probably a Cavan player. They won All Ireland’s in 1947, 48, 52 and lost out on a three in a row to Meath in the 1949 final. Mick Higgins was captain in 52 and played in the city of his birth, New York in the 1947 final, so would imagine he’s one.